I figure if I have to revive it in some manner, I played it too long. Many have accused me of not playing fish, just horsing them in. Guilty, I guess.
I’ve had small trout that took less than 10 seconds to bring in, and another 10 to unhook & release that acted funny and needed a little reviving. I’m not convinced that the need to revive a fish is in any way a sign that it’s been exhausted.
Still, I think we need to keep in mind that if these fish were so fragile as we think of them, they’d have likely not survived for thousands, or millions, of years. While there is certainly something to be said for respecting the animal, I think many times the fly fishing community goes a bit off the deep end in their efforts. I mean, like others have said, if we’re so concerned about the well-being of the fish, a good place to start would be to not go out and fool it into eating bits of sharp metal and pulling it around against its will.
The fact that we continue in that at all reflects on our attitudes toward the fish.
Reality is…there is a mortallity rate. Fishing is a blood sport that we manipulate into a C&R sport. But no matter how concerned in which you handle fish, some will die. Some of which seemed perfectly fine when released. I think however that they are heartier then we give them credit for though. As Coughlin alluded to, I’ve caught many fish with line and net marks on them. I think most of us attain an effienciency in handling fish over time that allows for a pretty quick release. And most all of us give more than enough effort and concern to reviving fish before releasing. That’s really the best you can do IMO.
I’m in the same camp with NJT and Cold on this one, for sure. Wild trout, especially big wild trout, are a lot tougher than most people seem to think. Being hooked and landed quickly is probably one of the milder things they experience over their lifetimes.
Several years ago, on one small river in the Central Mountains of ID, I caught the same 17" rainbow trout in the same place the same way on three out of four outings over a period of about three weeks. He was just as healthy and strong the third time as the first time. Last September, on a little cutthroat stream in Eastern Idaho, I caught a 20" cutthroat, and admittedly handled it somewhat rougher than I liked. Ten days later, Peter Morris of Blue Hills, Australia caught the same fish after I invited him to fish the same pool.
A couple years ago, a fellow I know told me his wife caught a good size rainbow on the Henry’s Fork. It broke her off. Ten minutes later, this guy was into a nice bow. When he landed it, his wife’s fly was still in the bow’s jaw.
Even though big wild trout are very tough, to my experience and way of thinking, they are suseptible to the effects of high water temps. One of our Central Mountain streams seems to have been just about wiped out by our long, hot, dry summer of '07. ( See my thread on “A Question of Ethics.” ) Few, if any, of the hundreds, if not thousands of wild bull, bow, and brook trout in that stream, were hooked that summer. Hook and land a big, tough trout in marginal or worse conditions, and it will likely not survive that experience.
John
If you ever work at a trout hatchery spawning fish, or do similar work with salmon or steelhead (tagging at a trap, for instance), the myth of “touch it and it will die” will be dispelled. Yes, there is a certain amount of mortality from any traumatic experience, but like many here have stated, fish are not nearly as delicate as some would like to believe. Just my opinion based on 30+ years of observation and the odd day of actual work.
Couple of years ago, I was fishing the Farmington River in CT while the Hendricksons were on. A guy fishing about 150 feet upstream from me and hooked a fish that put a pretty good bend in his rod. The fish ran downstream and he began following it. Several fishermen reeled in to let him pass by, all of us thinking he had a monster on. He finally wound up in deep water about a hundred yards from where he started. He played the fish out there. It was laying on it’s side, totally exhausted as he netted it. Of course, a number of people were watching him by now.
He had played that fish for at least ten minutes, and it turned out to be a brown of about 14". When questioned about why he played it as he did, the knucklehead explained he was using an 8X tippet on a size 12 Hendrickson nymph! He spent several minutes attempting to revive the fish with no success.
That’s an extreme example, but the guy defended his actions by saying that he felt using such a light tippet was “more sporting”, and furthermore he had been told that he had to use 8X on the Farmington or he wouldn’t catch anything.
And it didn’t matter what rod weight he was using. He could have been using a 3 weight or a 9 weight and the defining factor would have been the tippet, not the rod. Still, the guys an idiot.
Several fishermen reeled in to let him pass… 
Man, I would not have even wet a line if there were several fishermen in 150 feet.
You folks must be desperate!
I’ve seen some mud holes where there were many people with poles and lines in the water. But that sure isn’t fishing, that’s bull droppings.
It does beg the question, did he eat the fish or waste it? Of course, we will never be sure.
First of all this is eastern fishing in a river within driving distance of NYC. You may turn your nose up at it, but this is what we have, and it is far from a mudhole.
Second, it is a C&R area, so I imagine the racoons got the fish.
'coons gotta eat, too…
Released a beautiful sea-run dolly varden on Sunday of over 20". The stream is very small and the fish slowly swam away from me and rested in riffles no more than 50’ across from me and slightly below. The water was 6" deep at most. A bald eagle dropped and picked the dolly up and flew off with it…
Eagles gotta eat, too…
Certainly the eagle is no more noble nor more natural than the 'coon.
Kenai River rainbows of any size show obvious cleft palate scars, with missing and mangled mandibles the norm rather than the exception…
I actually caught a salmon the other day with a gill raker sticking out from the gill cover. If I had to guess it looked like an old hook injury.
I have released far too many fish to believe they all lived… And I will sleep tonight because I know everyone I did not release died.
art
…“I have released far too many fish to believe they all lived… And I will sleep tonight because I know everyone I did not release died.
art”…
LOL…very well put Art:)
Nuclear Stupid.
…but first, you’ll know if a fish isn’t going to make it pretty much if they go belly up once they swim off out of arms reach in the deeper water.
To criticize other fishers for using lighter tippet than necessary, or playing/releasing tactics suggests that at one time in a fishers history, prolly back in their beginnings, that they did just the same.
Just so no one thinks i’m not guilty of all the above scenarios, i’m here to say i
am. But i’ve learned and from where…watching more experienced fishers, from reading and in the past 20 of my 54 yrs of flyfishing, TV programs and now the internet (youtube) and not to forget FAOL posts with info on all the topics mentioned above.
I got away from the recommended spools of 1.5 lb. tippet of yore and now i try to stay heavier than 4x where i can. Rarely do i have to resort to 5x but i do have 6 and 8x in storage in case i go to mythical waters where i’m told you can’t catch anything with heavier tippet than 6, 7, or 8x.
Getting to the point…ask yourselves if you haven’t cast any of the stones as mentioned above at sometime in your fishing careers. I’m thinking the list will be short or perhaps there will be no positive reply at all.
From my point of view, play 'em up hard and fast, slip the barbless/pinched down barb hook while the fish stays in the water and unless yer gonna eat that sucka, (and this will offend, i know…but this is still a free country last i checked) cease with the ‘sand and gravel’ pics. Man, that gets me every time.
Those that mentioned the side to side with the rod playing up method have it right…this waist high rod but, tip pointing to the sky while the guy in the pic is grinning from ear to ear doesn’t get it.
Again so no one will think i’m not a trout killer, i’ve killed plenty, but mostly ate them…i have had to let bleeders (pretty much dead when that happens) go but for fish hooked/released, i figure i’m feeding some other critter. Maybe not but it helps me sleep nights. Anyway.
MontanaMoose
I do have a semi-related question about you folks’ opinion of fish mortality:
A few weeks back, I hooked a fish, but instead of the corner of the mouth or even edge of the lip, it was hooked…just about halfway between its nose and the corner of its mouth, on the top jaw. When I removed the hook, it started bleeding form the puncture wound the hook made. It was just a pin hole, but, like a paper cut, it bled for a while. I put the fish back in the water, and it took off as if unharmed. I fished the hole for another 20 minutes, and even saw that same fish swim by several times and make a few rises. It seemed totally fine.
Do you guys think it ended up okay or that it eventually died from that tiny hole? I think it was fine, but I’m not sure how lethal ANY bleeding really is. I agree that gill bleeding generally means the end of that fish, but this was clearly a puncture wound from the hook.
Cold, in response, it’s anybody’s guess. My son and I have caught fish with such severe deformities it would seem impossible that they could have lived to gain 18-inches and several pounds, but they were healthy and agressive and we put them back to fight another day. (See the Dad and the Kid fishing report to see a pic of a severely deformed Cutt that was truly full of vim and vigor)
Since we don’t live in the fish’s world it’s hard to tell what really happens, but we all should be concerned with conserving our sport. I know there are strong feelings about this and many are in several different camps so I’ll not preach other than to say we all have a responsibility to be responsible. I practice catch-and-release almost exclusively except for those few rare times when I don’t. The resource is not endless and so we have to be good stewards, this goes both ways in maintaining a healthy fishery, in that stewardship I harvest a few fish now and then and enjoy them immensely.
I fish with 6x tippet on most of the waters I fish and I’m able to land fish quickly and release them to fight another day. Learning how to do this takes some level of skill attained over many years of experience. If they break off I revel in the fact that I was able to fool them with a bit of hair, feathers and steel of my own creation, and I move on to the next opportunity, but I never fight them differently because of the 6x, some I fish with are amazed that I bring the fish in so quickly.
One thing I have advocated for those who may be working on their experience and competence level is to use a heavier tippet and attach their flies with a Duncan Loop in order to impart a more lifelike action to their offering. This method has worked for me countless times and now I rarely tie any fly - dry or wet - onto my line without using a Duncan Loop knot.
As far as using a lighter rod and that adding to the dilemma of fighting a fish too long, I would submit that 3x, 4x, 5x, or even 8x is still that tippet weight and tensil breaking strength no matter which rod you use.
Learning how to fight a fish correctly is a skill every flyfisher should be required to learn in order to fight and land his quarry quickly and without further undue stress than that which we already impart by practicing our sport.
We all must admit that there is a bit of “blood sport” in what we do, even if we release the fish. We’ll never be able to change this, but we all have a responsibility to do our best to practice our sport as humanely and proficiently as possible. My skill level will be different than yours and so on. We must do the best we can as often as we are on the water. The fish deserve our respect and reverence while we are in their domain, and we need to be responsible stewards in everything we do.
Now, that being said, there are many who practice and believe differently than I do, does that mean they are wrong or that I am wrong? I hope that none of the flyfishing community is that narrow-minded as to believe that their “way” is the only way. Let’s all be responsible participants and agree that we can all disagree on some points but must be united in order to continue to maintain our sport and chosen activity for future generations.
Wow, what a diatribe. Sorry if I’ve offended any, but this is how “I” feel about this subject. Thanks, Utah David, for compelling us with this ethical and perhaps moral question.
Kelly.
P.S.: I’ve got pictures of fish from my favorite spring creek that were taken one or two years apart and they are of the same fish, only larger. Each fish’s markings are as different as you and me.
While I have nothing new to add to these replies I would like to say I’m very impressed with the replies and the CIVILITY of how they were expressed. I’ve been on other boards where a question like this turns into a knock-down drag-out fight complete with name-calling and almost to the point of threats. It’s nice to read 3+ pages of replies that are diverse yet civil in their tone. thanks to all!
I too am very impressed with the politeness of this discussion. I would be happy to fly fish with any of you. In our catch and release, I know we try to be as careful and as respectful of the quarry we are fishing for, even though at times many of us are branded as the villains & criticized harshly.
Cold -
I would bet the farm that that fishy went on to a very long and healthy life after that little wound healed.
John
P.S. I don’t have a farm.
It comes down to opinion and some thought for me. I won’t fish in extendrd
hot tempratures and especially low water conditions don’t handle the the fish
and when in doubt I will be extremly careful. I hope I was clear as mud this is only my opinion.
Flyfisher121
I find the longer I play the fish the greater the chance of losing it and not getting a good picture of it. It becomes even more challenging on barbless hooks at C&R places too.