Thanks for all the great info on my post regarding my entry into rodbuilding. As a result of many of your posts, I have been rethinking, adding to my initial rod building bucket list. I think a rainshadow blank is the way to go, since I want a decent rod I can use on the water as long as it doesn’t look like my 5 year old built it. I need a 3wt rod, so I was looking at the rainshadow 7’9" 3wt blank for my first attempt. My vision is to use this on small mountain streams in North Georgia after I finish relocating the family to the Atlanta area. I want a 4 piece so I can stick it in a backpack, but the whole belly/spine part of the videos I watched is scaring me. I imagine it is easier finding the belly on a 2piece, but I want a functional rod. Am I getting in over my head with a 4 piece blank?
You may want to look at the Forecast kits from Stockard for a first attempt. I’m new to this craft and what I do is find the spline of each piece. Then I put them together and find the spline for the rod and adjust if necessary. There are more experienced folks here so I’ll ask a spline question I’ve been wondering about. Do the guides and wraps affect the spline?
[FONT=Palatino-Roman][SIZE=2][LEFT]From a purely technical standpoint, it is therefore reasonable to state that a rod built on stiffest/straightest axis has a greater deadlift capacity than a rod built on the effective spine.The idea that rods built off-spine will fail sooner than rods built on the spine is incorrect. In fact, exactly the opposite istrue. Having the cumulative thicker wall predominantly on the compression side of any blank flex results in greater lifting[/LEFT]
capacity before failure.
[FONT=Palatino-Roman][SIZE=2][FONT=Palatino-Roman][SIZE=2]
[LEFT]So does the slight difference between having the stiffest or softest axis on the compression side make any practical difference to the rod builder or angler? Considering that few styles of fishing allow for casting and fighting on a single axis,any great concern over blank orientation would appear unwarranted.However, the reader is left to draw his or her own[/LEFT]
conclusions as needed for their personal requirements.
[FONT=Palatino-Italic][SIZE=1][FONT=Palatino-Italic][SIZE=1]
[LEFT]Wall thickness around the circumference of a rod blank is not verbatim. This anomaly is caused by the process of wrapping a sheet of material (prepeg) around a tapered mandrel. It can also be influenced by the sanding process that takes place during[/LEFT]
blank stripping and finishing.
[FONT=Palatino-Italic][SIZE=1][FONT=Palatino-Italic][SIZE=1]
[LEFT]Nor is wall thickness consistent from tip to butt along anyparticular axis. There is a cumulative effect - whichever axis places the greatest amount of material on the compression side of the flex, will be the stiffest/strongest axis. Whichever axis places the least amount of material on the compression side of the flex, will be the softest/weakest axis (spine).Note that the stiffest and softest axis on a blank are rarely[/LEFT]
180 degrees opposite each other.
In conclusion, spining of a blank is one of the most controversial topics related to rodbuilding.
To do it is not incorrect, to not do it and build on the straightest axis is also not incorrect.
[/SIZE][/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT]
[/SIZE][/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT]
I spine all of my rods but not for the reasons above. My feeling, and basic physics supports this, is that the rod will be more accurate if it is bending in the direction it wants to bend naturally.
I was told to roll the thicker pieces on a flat surface to find the curvager then mark. Put them all together once you have checked all four pieces sight down the blank and turn each piece to its straightest point. Question is, do you want a blank that is straight or built on a spline and not straight. I too am asking myself this question as I am also building a 4pc blank
My opinion is that finding the spine allows you to ensure the rod is allowed to bend the direction it naturally wants to bend. Doing this will keep teh rod from fight ing itself or you when you try to direct the line to go a certain direction.
I find the spine on each section, then assemble the rod and double check how it comes out. If things are not lined up properly, the heavier sections will over ride the lighter ones. I check my findings until they all agree. which they will.
Geez … don’t come on this board in a coons age and find folks I know.
Now Kevin … do you put the guides on the stiff or soft side of the spine? <G>
Nope. You’re not in over your head. It’s just two extra pieces to spine.
You’re gonna like the Rainshadow, btw.
I’ll weigh in on this because I’ve seen this discussion MANY times…did I say many times lol.
I agree with Ron. I “use” to spine my rods, but no longer do and just do them by the straightest axiz. So …on the same token…I agree with Kevin about inline casting.fighting fish. But, here’s where I split it lol.
If your fighting a fish/casting Directly inline with the spine of the rod, then I think yes, spining the rod may help a tad. But most times in casting/fighting a fish, your not fighting or casting “directly” inline with the spine of the rod , so it kind’a goes’ out the window where the spine my be.
But…it’s all how you perceve it is what it boils down too more than anything. I don’t think anyone is right or wrong to be honest. How’s that for murky?lol
Steve
+1. Save yourself the worry and hassle and build on the straightest line of each section. If you can’t find it, then just put the guides on. If you think splining makes a difference, try taking one of your rods, and turn the top half 90 degrees off. Bet you can’t tell a difference in casting or bringing in a fish. Sure, in theory, it might make a small difference, but in real application, it is so minute that you won’t be able to detect it. My opinion only, and from past experience I can tell you that there are others who will (nearly violently) disagree. :rolleyes:
I don’t think that matters as long as they are on the plane the rod is trying to bend in.
I don’t think it helps with fighting or any of the usual stuff, only in accuracy.
As blank manufactuing continues to improve along with materials, finding the “Spine” can be difficult. Kevin makes some very good points here. Do you want one section trying to twist right while another is heading left? It’s doubtful you would even notice!! Until after a long day casting! There could be a fatigue issue at least.
Regardless if it really makes any difference or not, it takes a very short time to do and I have had enough customers comment on how nice their new rods cast that I am going to continue to do it. I tell them that I do it and why. I also tell them that the jury is still out on whether it really does anything for you or not but that it makes sense to me, so why not?
Not to dissagree with Kevin because we have had these spine conversation on other boards (Redheads Kevin LOL) and it is all a matter of personal preference. But with that said, to answer “why not’. I use to spine my rods but no longer do unless we are talking a REALLY heavy rod like a 12wt and up. The main reason why I don’t is because 95% of all rod blanks today do have a slight curve towards the tip. Dosen’t matter if it is a $25 ebay blank or a $350 Sage, chances are it has a very slight curve in it in the last 5” of the tip. Every great once in awhile you will find one dead straight, but that’s rare. Just because of the process in rolling them and the thinness of the graphite it is almost impossible to keep it dead on straight.
So two things about that…
#1- when you build on the straightess axis then you can turn the slight bend upward, and use the weight of the last guide&tip top to make the slight curve upward end up straight.
#2- “if” the slight spine of a rod would in some way affect the accuracy of a cast (which means the spine would have to be so powerful that it would change the direction of the weight of 30ft of fly line which I just don’t see happening myself, but “if” it could do that…then you would think a slight curve in the end of the tip would have an even more drastic affect on casting, right? So that actually makes the argument for building on the straightest axis in it’s own way I would think.
But again like I said, none of this is anything that can really be tested in any way and is all just personal opinions so neither the spine nor straightest axis crowd either one can say 100% which is proven best. I say just read up on it, do a few rods spined, a few on the straightest axis, cast them, sight down them, and see which side of the fence you end up falling on.
Steve