Some serious discussion, please

[Betty Hiner]

Last week I had an ?unfortunate? experience on the water. I posted on here to expunge it from my soul, and to apologize. As I expected from my FAOL family, I was given support (lots), an a** wuppin' (or two or three!), love, and laughter.

Now, I would like to know seriously, when confronted by interlopers, be they in the stream (wading, boating, rafting) or on the land (fly casters, bait casters, obnoxious children), what should you do? I know it's best to keep the calm, and discuss with them the proper etiquette. But REALLY, what can you humanly do in that situation? How do you REALLY handle it? How can we change our persona from persona non grata to personable?

I know this situation will happen again, be it here, there, or wherever, to you, or me and we need to know what to do. Hopefully, with a sincere, honest discussion, this kind of aggravation can be limited (I know it will never go totally away) and peace can reign on the trout streams.

(Thank you, Ed)


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Trouts don't live in ugly places




[This message has been edited by Betty Hiner (edited 22 June 2006).]

[Fly Time]

Betty, seems we all run into stream side challenges from time to time. During the steelhead runs here in western NY it can get pretty crazy. I have had my share of simply rude folks who will walk right up and crowd me out. Had a drift boat just about run me over up on the Salmon River one year. My response to such situations can vary depending on how big and how many of them there are???But seriously folks - if I perceive they may just not understand what they are doing I will try to strike up a conversation that leads around to some advice regarding how they just walked through a pool of fish that I was tying to catch. Don???t know why, but sometimes I feel it is some sort of duty or something to educate others. That kind of thinking, however well intended, can get one in trouble. Some folks are not always receptive to friendly advice. As nice as having a stream side conversation regarding all this sounds, I have to say that most of the time I just walk away and try to find some peaceful spot on the stream. The peace is what I seek more than the fish.

[jsmartt]

The older I've become, the more considerate I've become to my fellow fishermen. In my younger days (from childhood to my mid thirties I mostly fished mountain streams where I would never see another fisherman. Thus courtesy to other fishermen was not an issue. Later as I moved about due to jobs etc. I began fishing areas where I was no longer alone. I must admit that in my zeal to fish a certain hole whre I knew a big fish resided I sometimes intruded too close to other fishermen. I didn't make a practice of it but I know I did on occasion. Now that I'm older and somewhat wiser, I'm content to fish some of the less productive areas on a river if the best spots are all occupied. I think that part of this better fisher edicutt comes from the general mellowing that comes with age and some from the fact that I've caught lots of big fish and no longer feel compelled to get the big one. I have noticed that fly fishermen as a whole tend to be courteous. When I run into a clueless fisherman I try to refrain from being confrontational. I usually try to engage them in some conversation. People tend to give more respect to others if they get to know them even a little.

[This message has been edited by jsmartt (edited 22 June 2006).]

[MrFishingToughGuy]

Stick a barbed hook in 'em and yank hard!

OK, seriously though. I think FT is right on. I don't like to avoid confrontation when it's a legitimate means of solving a problem. I like face-to-face conflict resolution if that's how it must be done.

But fishing is my only therapy and I like to keep it therapeutic, so I generally avoid discourse that will get me started off on the wrong foot. Trying to strike up a general conversation sometimes works, and you might find the person so congenial that you could fathom dealing with their presence. I have dealt with meatchuckers on my favorite stretch of artificials-only river, generally by saying, "hey, I don't know if you're aware, but this is an artificials only area because the DNR is concerned about fish swallowing the hooks too deeply, which could ruin this fishery. It's not stocked - they're all wild fish." That has only been ineffective once, and when the guy shouted back a litany of expletives about me and the MD state DNR, I called the poaching hotline. And didn't tell him...although he found out when the officer arrived.

FT is also on point when talking of the WNY steelhead fishing. Some of those guys are downright rude and feel that their license payment justifies the invasion of any and every hole, but they occupied by others or not. And lots of those folks are not of the pleasant variety - they'll threaten you with bodily harm. In those cases, it's not worth the hassle and I'll find a secluded place where the trashy sort don't venture...if I can.

Marty
MFTG

[This message has been edited by MrFishingToughGuy (edited 22 June 2006).]

[HideHunter]

I'm just simply not the one to ask.

I grew up in a river town where such a transgression would very probably result in one party or the other sitting on their butt bleeding out their nose.

This, admittedly, was before a time when the likely outcome was that you were shot, stabbed or sued.

Maybe it's an Iowa thing. Check out Rick Z's response to someone crowding him.

[Crotalus]

I am a "dont sweat the small stuff" kinda guy. If someone tosses a fly into my "spot" it doesnt really bother me in the big picture as long as they dont interfere with my personal space, and that includes my ability to cast and retrieve my fly. One of us will move on sooner or later.

I go fishing to relax not to get into arguments, if that means me moving to another spot then so be it. But usually the interloper moves on first since they are generally looking for greener pastures.

I also tend to not give etiquette lessons, i am not a teacher and i dont feel the need to lecture others

[Betty Hiner]

OK ... so they've walked, boated, moved into your personal space. How do you say something, and what do you say to them? Should you even try to say something, or should you just reel in and leave the area? Does that teach them (leaving) that what they've done is acceptable?

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Trouts don't live in ugly places

[Jonezee]

Betty: I think the problem is like Road Rage. Some or most states have strict laws against it. You can be fined and put in jail for honking or pointing a finger at someone who tries to cut you off. Of course the reason behind all this is so no one gets into a bang up all our fight and something serious happens as a result. You decide how important it is for this guy to make his play and spoil your day....I don't think after all is said and done it would be worth it to confront him. Like in the motor car road rage incidents, sometimes the other guy is flat out nuts and has a gun. What are you going to pull out to level the field?
As the saying goes...there are more fish in the sea to catch another day.

[This message has been edited by Jonezee (edited 22 June 2006).]

[J Castwell]

Does that teach them (leaving) that what they've done is acceptable?

Not my job to 'teach' them anything. By now they have not learned, not likely my 'instruction' will be helpful.

[GBurgFisher]

Betty you raised some good points and I completely support the decision you made to confront that gentleman. To me, its an issue of levels. You know some people are just totally clueless. Others know better and do it anyway. I have about zero tolerance for the latter. It?s a really tough question. In my opinion there are two types of people that give advice on the stream. One is the person who is absolutely full of themselves and is pointing out some minute flaw to puff up their already aggrandized ego. The second type is the person that?s actually out to help you catch more fish, and generally wants to see others succeed. I would urge anyone to attempt the latter if you are actually going to make a comment to someone. Around here almost every stream has some sort of posting board. Maybe if there is a particular stream that you are noticing this going on frequently, you could print out and post some sort of ?common stream etiquette? sheet and put it up on the board.