Deer Hair

[mickporter]

In the fly tiers benchside, there is a paragraph that mentions Al Beatty's method of knowing which deer hair will flare etc when tied, it gives two examples. Is this an exact science?

I am having problems with my collection of deer hair. I have no idea what animal some of it is from, no idea where on the body it has been cut from, and no idea (without testing it I suppose) which will flare and which I can use for wings. In the article Al says the deeper the dark colouring goes the less likely it is to flare, and the lighter in colour (from the tips down) the more it is likely to flare.

Has anyone any tips for me to identify my stocks? Some of it has really short fur, about a 1/4" to 3/8" long, what is this useful for?

[Joe Valencic]

Mick,

Simply take a sample from each patch of hair, and tie it onto a hook and see to what extent it will flare (if at all). Record your findings by writing on the back of the hide as to what the results were, or by attaching a tag to the hide.

A quick reference for various hairs can be found in Chris Helm's online catalog. Chris is one of the world's top authorities on deer hair. Simply go to his website at http://www.whitetailflytieing.com/ and click on his online catalog, which is in PDF format. Go to pafe 14 of the catalog for a description of hairs and their uses.

Good luck!

Joe

[tigfly]

[QUOTE=Joe Valencic;243540]Mick,

Simply take a sample from each patch of hair, and tie it onto a hook and see to what extent it will flare (if at all). Record your findings by writing on the back of the hide as to what the results were, or by attaching a tag to the hide.


Mick, even though you have a lot of deer hair it is still worth doing it this way. All of my pieces are labeled on the hide for a particular use. Such as Comparadun, Short tips for example or EHC (elk hair caddis) Long tips. This gives me good idea of the nature of the deer hair. I have a couple of deer hides that I cut up and labeled. It sure makes things a lot easier than trial and error at the vise. Also, like Joe said, Chris Helm is the expert on deer/elk hair and I have seen him twice at flytying events. He is well worth talking with and as far as I know still answers his own phone if you call him with a question.

[mickporter]

Thank you for those replies. Yes I was being lazy, but your right I will have to knuckle down and try them. Labelling them is a great idea.

In the UK we tend to buy 'deer hair', it will be imported from the states, but is usually just marked generically and labeled 'deer hair' not matter what deer it comes from etc. I notice more and more suppliers are actually advertising hair from particular animals but not many.

We don't just go out and catch our own....... tends to be frowned upon by the Lords and ladies!!

[Mike-Connor]

Unfortunately this is extremely difficult. I have a very large collection of deer hair and the only way to tell if much of it is usable for a lot of things is to try it!

The various guides to hair, excellent though they are,

http://www.flyfishingconnection.com/...lies+with+hair

Are still somewhat general in application, and also apply mainly to American animals of course!

Deer hair, apart from the fact that hair from very many animals is termed "deer hair" the variation even among similar animals with regard to quality, colour and usability is massive.

It is far easier to mention a fly which you would like to dress, and ask which hair might be suitable, than ask about hair generally, as such a question is more or less impossible to answer!

TL
MC

http://www.mike1.bplaced.net/Wikka/HomePage

[DDRRedneck500]

i have a whole hide which i tanned myself and Al is exactly right. you can also kind of eyeball it too and the thinner it is the worse it is for spinning generally. i will try to get some pics of for you in a moment

[Al Beatty]

Hi Mick,

I've found the technique I use to be accurate about 85% of the time when "just buying hair in a fly shop." On the other hand it is quite accurate when you know the type of deer hair that is in the package; for example it works really well on white tail deer but is less accurate on mule deer. I'm told it doesn't work at all for a species of deer in Florida (USA) but I can't think of the name right at the moment.

If you buy your hair from Chris Helm and ask him specifically to select it for a particular purpose, you can be quite certain you will get what you want. I buy all of my wing/tail deer hair (deer hair in bulk) from him and have never been dissappointed in the more than 20 years I've been doing so. Take care & ...

Tight Lines - Al Beatty
www.btsflyfishing.com

[DDRRedneck500]

to give you an idea heres a few pictures. this is a white tail deer btw

this is not quite a whole hide, but most of it. minus the head, legs and belly and tail. the front of the hide is on the right and the back where the tail would be is on the left. the white belly fur is the best for spinning. as you can see in the pic, there is a dark section running along the back of the deer. this section is not what you want for spinning deer hair.
a close up pic of this hair

you can see how much darker it is than most other deer hair. this hair doesnt compress much and so is of no use to someone spinning deer hair. howeverto someone using it for a wing or maybe subbing for a type of hair that isnt hollow, it would work quite well.
in contrast here is some hair from the side of the deer close to the belly.

sorry about the pic quality but you can see how much lighter it is and you can actually see that it looks thicker. this is what you want for spinning deer hair. muddlers, poppers, dahlburgs, whatever you want to tie, this is what you want. also as you get closer to the tail of the deer, the hair gets longer. the tail hair doesnt spin well, but the hair leading up to it is great for tying BIG poppers and dahlburgs. the hair as you get closer to the head and around the legs is much shorter, and i only use this for really small bluegill poppers and muddlers.
anyways, hope this helps

[mickporter]

Yes it does thanks.........

Al thanks for your reply. One of the reasons I began this post was that I need some deer hair to create wings and tails. I have found all of the patches I have got flair up regardless of its colour. Some admittedly worse than others.

Perhaps I am expecting too much. Does all deer hair flaire to some extent? If I tie with squirrel tail I don't get any problems. Maybe I am tying it in incorrectly causing it to pulled around hook shank I don't think so!

Most likely is that I have the wrong type of fur. Perhaps I should seek the expert you reccomend and spend my cash!!!

[Mike-Connor]

Yes it does thanks.........


Perhaps I am expecting too much. Does all deer hair flaire to some extent? If I tie with squirrel tail I don't get any problems. Maybe I am tying it in incorrectly causing it to pulled around hook shank I don't think so!

Most likely is that I have the wrong type of fur. Perhaps I should seek the expert you reccomend and spend my cash!!!

No, there is lots of deer hair which only flares minimally or not at all. Most of it is however compressible to some extent, and the amount of flaring also depends on thread pressure and underbody.

Squirrel tail is a hard slippery incompressible hair, which can be difficult to use as a result. Various tricks are usually necessary to make sure squirrel hair wings don?t pull out.

There is some info in the link I originally gave on this;
http://www.flyfishingconnection.com/...lies+with+hair

TL
MC

http://www.mike1.bplaced.net/Wikka/HomePage