I built a 4wt Forecast rod kit during the winter. I finally got to fish with it a few weeks ago and I couldnt cast more then 20’ with it. I need to find out if I built it wrong or if its the line I’m using. The line is a WF 4wt Cortland 333, not the best but I got it for next to nothing. Whats happening is that the line just isn’t going threw the guides, at any spectrum of the cast. The only time I can get a cast past 20’ is if I muscle the cast and almost throw myself into the water. So is there something I can put on the guides reduce friction? Next if that doesnt work I’m going to purchase a SA Mastery series line or the Headstart line. I have one on my TFO 2wt and it cast like a rocket. Finaly what else could I do if that doesnt work, I’d hate to junk the rod if I built it wrong. If it makes a difference when building the rod I made the spine go inside for better fighting power then casting power, did that cause the rods inability to cast? Thanks for any help guys!
Hi Tim,
Sometimes blanks advertised for a certain line rating are in fact much different than other brands for the same line weight.
You might try tossing a 6-weight line on that rod and see if you can get it to wake-up.
Let us know how it goes.
Fred
You can spend lots of money trying to guess and isolate the problem. I suggest going to a local fly shop and trying some different lines. Try and isolate the problem.
Try another 4 wt. line, then a 6. See if either make a difference. (This isolates the line as a problem)
Try your line and reel on another rod and see if that is better. (This isolates the rod)
You really have only two items in the equation, line and rod. Well, three if you count yourself. Knowing nothing about you, I added this not as an insult, but as a thought if nothing else makes a difference. So if the above did not help try another rod and line. (This isolates the fisherman).
You might also ask the “Pro” there to try the combination and venture an opinion.
Then, after you figure out the problem, consider buying the solution from the shop that helped you.
Good luck.
jed
Unfortunatly there are no “Fly Fishing Shops” around the area just tackle shops, so there expertise is questionable. I do have 2 other rods I can test the line on first, a 2wt and a 6wt. I’ll see if I can just rule out the line first. Thanks guys!
Tim,
From your brief description, sounds like the rod is probably “underlined” with the #4 line on it.
Frustrating ,… I know.
Can’t get it to shot. Will it move with a double haul? Not fun, but it will help diagnose the situation.
I assume you have another reel laying around. If you have a HEAVIER line, … any line, try it. Don’t even re-spool your reel.
I had a heck of a time “lining” up a nice combo when I move DOWN to a 5 wt. and understand your frustration.
If you don’t have a heavier line laying around, beg, borrow or steal 
one just to try it out.
If you’re REALLY stuck, e-mail me your adress and I’ll send you a 6wt WF I don’t use anymore. Don’t send it back, just promise to use it or give it away 
Christopher Chin
Jonquiere Quebec
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[This message has been edited by fcch (edited 23 May 2005).]
Thank you for the suggestion fcch. Thats the exact problem it wont shoot, not even with a double haul. The only time I can get it to go is when I throw my entire body into the cast and fall head first into the water. And it is just this rod I’m having a problem with my TFO casts great, I can get a 60’ cast if not more out of that little 2wt. I’ve got an old 6wt hanging around some where I just have to find it. Thank you for the offer if I cant find it I’ll let you know. Thanks again!
Tim, how many pieces, what length? What guide spacing did you use?
The 333 line should be fine.
Joe
It was a 8’6" 2 piece 4wt Forecast rod. I used the spacing provided by Hook&Hackle’s catalog.
Tim,
Other than the suggestions made by others, here’s a possibility: The guides are not properly spaced.
If they are, you will observe the following:
Thread the line through the guides and allow several feet beyond the tip. Step on the end of the line and create an arch with the rod.
Notice if there are any sharp angles where the line goes from one guide to another. There should be a smooth transition between the guides. If not then your spacing is off.
Another possibility is that the guides are the wrong size or too heavy. By the way, how many guides are on the rod?
I really don’t know if the spline location makes a difference because I’ve read it does and also that it doesn’t.
Of course the blank could have been mislabeled and you’ll need some different weight line.
Good luck.
Allan
Tim, do you have a total of nine guides (8 snake and 1 stripper) with the stripper guide about 31" from the very bottom (reel end) of the rod?
Joe
[This message has been edited by flyfisherjoe (edited 23 May 2005).]
That sounds about right I have to check when I get home, at work right now. I’ll also check the guides for any sharp angles. Now lets say there are bad angles and the stripper guide is not at the right hight then what would I do then?
This sounds like a crappy job but you will have to take off the eyes and rewrap them correctly. I built a Forecast 7’6" 3 wt and had everything on the rod and took it to a friend. He said the eyes were not lined up properly. Sooooooo, I rewrapped all of the eyes luckily they were not coated yet.
Seege
As a last resort, if the guides are placed wrong, worse case would be having to carefully cut off the guides and redo them. Hopefully, that’s not the problem.
Can you accurately measure the blank diameter at some reference points? The butt wouldn’t be possible with the seat on but maybe the tip or various distances. You could then call Hook and Hackle or Batson and verify the blank is the 4wt.
Joe
Tim,
Most of the Forecast line runs pretty true to the rated line wt. I’ve heard nothing but good things about them.
It could be the guides if you have major misalignment problems.
I ran into the same thing trying to use Cortland 333 line on a 5wt factory rod and on a 9wt factory rod. I wouldn’t use 333 line for anything except staking tomatoes personally. It just will not shoot,expecially when it gets hot!
Just my $.02.
Alex
When the experts disagree,the ignorant are free to choose.
Tim,
I noticed you mentioned a WF line. Is there a chance it could be spooled up backwards?
Steve
I have a 7 weight 333 line. I’ve experienced better casting with it on cooler weather. I know, a little heavier than a 4wght. I’m ready to go for a new line. Something with a nice slick coating…
I’m pretty sure the line went on correctly however I wouldnt put it past me to spool it on backwards. However If I did put it on backwards wouldnt it just act like a DT line, since the wf part is so far up the line? I’ve tried it in cold and warm water no difference. I’ll check that as well.
[This message has been edited by Tim S (edited 23 May 2005).]
Tim,
I’m probably wrong but I think the rear section of a WF line is level. Not sure how far from the front end this section starts though.
Allan
Tim,
No, if you put on the WF line backwards, it won’t have enough weight in it to load the rod well. That actually could cause your problem. A WF line has the majority of it’s weight in the front section, with only a level running line for the rest. Allows for a lighter line to be ‘towed’ when shooting for distance, etc… This running line is VERY light, and isn’t likely to load your rod.
Unless you really screwed up the guide spacings (I hate the charts, they aren’t very good, but they aren’t bad enough to cause this level of performance drop) the rod should cast better than you are describing. Espedcially since it’s obvious that you CAN cast with a fly rod (I’ve not tried to cast 60 feet with my 2 wt., doubt I could).
So, first, either the line is ‘grabbing’ in the guides. Causes: the line coating is flawed and it’s gripping rather than sliding. Something is wrong with the guide(s). If you used wire guides they can be ‘bad’, even if new. Check with a cotton swab to see if there are any rough places. Something like that on a couple of guides, especially out near the tip, can act as a brake and litterally stop the line mid flight. I’ve not seen modern ceramic insert guides come from the factory damaged, but it is certainly possible.
OR, second, the rod weight is mis labeled (badly, even a five or six weight should cast better than that with a 4 wt. line). All the Forecast blanks I’ve built on have been pretty close to right on as far as line weight goes. Still, mistakes can occur. Someone accidentally sticking a 4 wt. label on an 8 wt. rod might account for this. Check the factory specs on the Batson Website and see if the tip diameter is correct for the rod. This will give you some inkling. If you can still get to the butt, or still have it written down someplace, that diameter will help too.
If you check the rod using the ‘Common Cents’ system, that can tell you what the correct line weight should be as well.
Other than that, I can’t think of any other likely reasons why a rod won’t cast.
Don’t worry about the spine effect. It’s there, but it’s negligible in any case.
Good Luck!
Buddy
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Thinking about it I dont think the line is backwards, I cant cast far enough to begin with for the thin end to be towing the wf section. That would mean I would have to be casting a good 50-60’ before it would reach the tapper. I’ll check with a cotton ball/q-tip when I get home tonight. I’ll check the website for the correct widths and such. Thanks guys!