Use a 1wt to target ? fish & type of fishing?

FAOL Community Fly Anglers Online
1

Sorry to be redundant here. But I learned an awful lot following the 2wt thread. I hope to learn as much here…although the subject may be getting a bit long in the tooth for some.

Is there that much difference between a 4wt and a 5 wt? I ask to lead to my main question. Is there that much difference between a 2wt and a 1wt. (Just purchased a 1wt line) so not just being a copy cat here. Really would like to here from all the guys that know so much. There is even an ought wt rod. Sooooo…what would one use a 1wt rod for. Panfish as well? Streams?..panfish on a lake? AND…how big a fish can you play and land on a 1wt rod. Now that I think about it I don’t know why I want to know…
I wouldn’t fish a 1wt for possible lunkers anyway. I do have an area I want to try a 1wt…but it is for very wild 3-5 inch fish only. Now that I think about it…I wouldn’t use a 1wt on my stream where I was pondering all the thoughts about a 2wt anyway.

But the pros and cons still interest me. I hope a bunch of you will make some kind of comments whether pro or con. I just wanna know…ya know? I just want to read an learn as much about a 1wt as I have now read and learned about a 2wt. I guess I am just an incurable optimist and untrainable as well.

Gemrod

2

Mr. Moose…Medford? Wow. Didn’t know you were there. Was there …uh…think in the '80’s. Liked the area and town. Think there was a cafe that was good…and for an omelet there was a choice of “THIRTY TWO” different ingredients! Never forget that. I fished with Buddy. Awesome. A hoot for me…probably not so much for him. He is one outstanding fly fisherman amongst other things.

Sooooo…if you don’t mind I will fill in for him up there until he can make it. Don’t know when I will get to dood it…but I have a burning desire and therefore a full intent to do a summer fishing run on the Pacific Northwest. I don’t know how to fish for the species up there. But I want to do it. I have already purchased 7-8-9-10 wt rods…lines…and reels.

Do YOU have a 1wt rod?

Gemrod

3

I used my one weight for trout and panfish. Fun rod to catch smaller fish on. At about 16-18" trout it starts to get interesting, as the bend in the rod approaches your hand. And it doesn’t throw big hairy flies worth beans, but it can be done.

As for how big of a fish? My best was a 12# salmon, with several steelhead in the 4-6# range. I do not recommend it, tho.

Remember, it’s not the rod that lands the fish, it is the person holding the rod.

4

Okay, I’ll bite. Out onto the limb I go.

In the purest sense, fly size begets tippet size begets line size begets rod size and also reel size.

IMHO there is no fishing situation in fresh water fly fishing that can’t be handled with 4 wt.'s through 8 wt.'s. Maybe carp or salmon out on the lake might want something bigger.

I have a 3 wt. I don’t need a 3 wt. My 4 wt. will do everything my 3 will do and some things it won’t. I just like to fish small streams with it. Its sort of cool. Not necessary, just cool. IMHO rods lighter than 4 wt. fall in that catagory. Kinda like an ultralight spinning reel. It’s your money. Fish any way you like. But you don’t really need to. It’s just kinda fun.

Sometimes you will need a bigger rod than the stuff you are casting dictates. This is for fighting big fish. Night time browns comes to mind. Maybe salmon or carp.

I have everything from a 3 to a 8 wt for fresh water. I even have a couple of 6’s. But I think I could effectively fish everthing I fish for with a 4 and a 7. I have more because you can never have too many rods or guns. It’s just that way, period.

Now for salt I have 8’s and 9’s. You sometimes have to throw 3/0 streamers out 80 to 100 feet and you ain’t gunna do that with a 3 wt., or a 2, or a 1, or a 0. And for tarpon, you’d need something bigger still.

So for me, those little rods are just for fun. And, at the end of the day, that’s what it’s all about.

Godspeed and good fishing,

Spend your money any way you wish, it’s your money,

Bob

5

Hello Gemrod, well I worked in Medford and Ashland but din’t live there. Medford is the airport that I can pick up fly fishers from to come fish the PNW. It’s half way between two places I stay and fish so it’s perfect in that sense. Plus there’s direct flights to Phoenix AZ. I have a resident OR license and an out of state CA license and I’ve fished a lot of the N.CA S.OR water, more so of the OR water by now…having been living here for ten roughly ten years. 22 in CA and keep a ‘cabin’ there that I’m working on just now, though slowed by the weather.

The cafe that fits the bill you speak of may be/may have been in Ashland and it is/was called ‘Brothers’. Great breakfast place before our run back to CA with my work. That was also in the 80’s…83 to 88 to be exact. Started fly fishing (the only kind I’ve done for about 20 years now. Yep, I had some spinfishing years also. Worms too…rubber and real.

I don’t have a 1 wt. Gemrod but I’ve cast at least one of them, maybe two…two posters here in FAOL own them actually. I have a Sage LL 2wt. I’ve yet to finish building and to be honest, the bulk of my fly fishing here in OR renders it useless. I would use it on little streams for brookies and such though. I have a pair of Sage 3wts, one an RPL, the other an LL and they’re the difference of night and day compared to the Sage LL 2wt. I have a Sage RPL 4wt that is one of my all time favorite fly rods and very useful, even in the area I fish here in OR and all of the water I fish in CA save when I’m fishing for steelhead.

I have a brown Fenwick 5wt., the one I recently managed about a 3.5-4 pound brown with at the lake in CA where the ‘cabin’ is. That was a surprise fish and I was glad I wasn’t using either of the Sage 3wts, especially when it happened three more times within half an hour not one hundred feet traveled for the four big trout. I don’t have a 6wt or a 7wt but I’m building a 7 soon hopefully.I don’t have an 8wt but I’ve got a dandy 9wt…a Bean’s LL 2pc 9 footer and I use it everywhere except small streams…as a rule…because I’ve used it on the Selway in ID.

I have a few other nondescript rods that I don’t use much if ever for various reasons. That’s about all I’ve got for you on rod wts. though I sure like going ‘overgunned’ opposed to going ‘undergunned’. I prolly use heavier tippet than required for many situations but like the other week at the lake, I didn’t get caught short with the 5wt and the 1x tippet behind a #4 leech pattern. Yep, that’s what the three browns and the big bow hammered and I mean hammered.

Ok, hope you get lots and lots of input in your ‘rod wts. defined’ quest. Oh and hey, cool you’re fillin’ in for Mr. Sanders. Just pm when you’re ready and we’ll I’ll pick you up in Medford.

Cheers,

MontanaMoose

6

Bob,
Thanks. It’s not a concern about spending the money for the equipment. I have it all already. Just don’t know what to do with it. When my wife passed last year…and I was not a very knowledgeable or good fly fisherman…having just gotten into it…I spent last summer buying rods, reels, and lines. I get a 9’ graphite and then see an 8’ Lamiglass…and hey…I don’t have one of those…so I wanna know how they work I buy it. I didn’t realize it but now think it was a way of coping. Anyway…now I have boatloads of rods, reels, and lines from 1-10. So it’s not about making decisions on what to buy. I already bought.

Just a sponge…insatiable desire to read about rods, reels, line, combos and fishing. And I really like to read short messages on here of one man’s opinon. I don’t really mean short messages…but input, ideas and opinions tidbits at a time. Can quickly read and think about it…as opposed to plowing through some 2" thick book…page by page…chapter by chapter. And what you get to read on here is about as current as it gets.

I like to experiment. I might try a 1wt line on that there little stream with only the tip section of one of my other rods. Heck…I am even pondering mono…crazy huh.

I am pretty sure this is by now a weary subject to most and so don’t expect much action here. I am beginning to think now that I can use the little rods for what ever I want to. And that would be special situations like the little wild stream covered with trees and only little 3-5" trout. That is a special situation calling for a small light rod. I go to my other favorite stream with 1.5 pound 15" trout with a possible monster…I just choose a different rod for the situation. I can use a 3-4-5 wt. I will just figure out what rods I want to use for the situation I find myself fishing for. No big deal. I have a natural desire to get to deep into it. Just my nature. These curiosities come up when you look on Global Dorber and see a 10wt full flex “1” wt blank. You wonder…what in the world does one want THAT for?

Anywhooooo…Bob, thanks for replying.

Gemrod

7

Montanna Moose
Appreciate the input. When I come to the PNW I intend to be pulling a self-contained 26’ toy hauler (which is actually 32’ end to end. They rate houses by livable space under roof…camp trailers by length of floor space. As you know some beds in the front stick out about 2 feet past the floor space) and spend as much time as I can up there. Maybe do a little Wa and N. CA as well. My son lives 52 miles north of S. F. May visit him for Christmas as we both live alone.

I think I got enough out of the 2wt thread to understand all I need to know about a 1wt. Sorta regret starting the thread…think I’m worn out on the subject as well. But 'tis still a good thread for me. I enjoyed and got a lot out of your msg icw Medford.

I am actually looking for a place to re-locate…that I can afford…and perhaps mild winter climates. I love bad sloppy snowy rainy weather…but my camp trailer pipes would freeze and too tough to fish. Think the coastal areas of OR or WA might have what I am looking for. Mountain Home, AR…87 miles south of Branson, MO is supposedly the number one place to fly fish in the U.S. And looks like good people and good area and very reasonable home prices. But…the PNW keeps calling me.

I wish I had gone to a good Orvis store or fly shop and just got fitted with rods and reels I like. I have spent far too much on impulse buying and have a lot of non-descript rods, reels, and line. I could have had maybe a 2-3-5-7-9 batch of very good rods that fit me if I had gone to the store and got fitted for them.

I’m kinda getting a handle on rods. Sort of by grouping. 1-3’s…4-6’s…etc. And what they are for, fish to use them for and how to use them. Each range has it’s place I think. I think I got it man.

Thanks MontannaMoose and all.

Gemrod

8

Obviously, the difference between a 1 and a 2 weight rod is much bigger than between a 4 and a 5 weight.
Since it has everything to do with lineweight, a 2 weight is twice as heavy as a 1 weight, a 5 weight is only 20% heavier than a 4 weight rod.
I use my 1 weight rod a lot even my Sage 0 weight comes into action sometimes, especially on very small streams with spooky fish.
Short casts, upstream fishing, lovely, already look forward to my next trip to a British chalkstream…
Cheers, Hans

9

Thanks Hans. I do have a very small tree covered stream with spooky fish. It is a challenge, the thrill of the hunt. I have 50 lakes and 800 miles of trout streams up here. So I could easily go elsewhere for bigger fish. But…I want to tackle this little stream which will only give up 3-5" trout. I do not have an O wt rod. But I want the lightest, short rig I can think of to rig up. I want to try to SENSE the bite of these little fish. It is very hard for me as the index finger of my rod holding hand is dead to all feeling from the mid knuckle to the fingernail. So sensetivity is difficult for me. But I do indeed have a little stream as you mention that I want to challenge. I’m thinking no strike indicator, no bb weight…just my hand and the fishy. Even thinking mono and a fly. Oh, well…the incurable optimist…or maybe curiosity seeker.

gemrod

10

Oh now that sounds good Gemrod, sounds to me like you’re free to roam about the country. One of my ‘wants’ is to go to AR too and sample the trout fishing there. Funny is the fact that the PNW calls you since the SW US is calling me. Kinda tired of being snowed, rained, hailed, sleeted and fogged in hereabouts. N. CA was mostly about the snow though. 3.500 ft where I lived. 20 or so years of that got old so I moved to OR to try the rain instead. If you like damp, foggy, rainy weather you can’t beat the PNW I’m thinking unless maybe you move to England.

One thing I notice in your rod list is that you don’t have enough ! Laughing here…but afterall, what is the sport about if not having all the tools and gadgets with which to perform best? Shoot, our passion/sport/hobby is cheap compared to some. Though destination fly fishing can get spendy and last summer kept me from going far, what with gas prices and all. Good luck in your quest to relocate and remember to pm when you’re in the neighborhood. I can be to the CA ‘cabin’ in several hours with advance notice and fire up the woodstove. The river and lake there are year rounders.

Cheers,

MontanaMoose

11

Many many years ago (said the old man ;)) there was this guy called Adam Trahan, running a site called smallstreams.com. His main goal was to catch the so called Apache trout somewhere in a small and remote stream in the mountains of Arizona.
One day he asked me to tie him some very small flies, size 26 and smaller, with a white wing and a black front-hackle. I tied him a few and armed with these tinies and his zero-weight he managed to catch these very spooky fish…
Big fun obviously…
Hans

12

A 2wt weight is not twice as heavy as a 1wt. Grain weight on a 1wt is 60 grains, a 2wt is 80 grains. A 4wt is 120 grains and a 5wt is 140 grains.

Jeremy

13

Good morning.
Hey, Gemrod,
“I am pretty sure this is by now a weary subject to most”

Weary, far, far from it as its all ‘good stuff’…

Just some thoughts about the subject.

I’ve been sitting back and quietly watching/reading both the threads till now.
I am also 2w owner, user, and fan of this wee little class of rod also.
I fish both the salt and the sweetwater with my 2w.

I own and use a Talon Graphite 2w xf 7’ 6" rod coupled to a LOOP Clear plastic reel, with a Talon W/F Line.

This rod is now is the only single hand rod I use as Doubles have covered all my other needs from a 5/6w Trout Spey through to a 15foot 10/11w for saltwater applications.

There appears to be a problem with most people’s thinking in what a ‘good’ 2w can do, be it, a, casting or b, fish fighting.

A, with casting
Casting a 2w it is critical that the caster can cast or is willing to learn to cast correctly, this almost silly statement is the 2w’s biggest problem. As every bodies ego has them as good casters.

The range of casts conducted should also include Spey casts which must include Roll casting where the wee little rod really shines when searching water be it lakes or streams.

I’ve found, maybe other have also that when fishing areas that are heavily fished or have just been fished by others (I totally enjoy these conditions) and the fish are in hiding, the 2w can arrive on the water and not frighten the fish, in fact they don’t seen to hear it arrive.

Here I am not talking about leaders but the fly line its self, as correctly cast it can arrive like a feather floating down onto the water.

This one fact to me is the 2w’s biggest advantage over other classes of rods to me.

B, with fighting a victim that is fighting for its life.
Here in these situations 99% of people just don?t know how much pressure that can be applied correctly to beat a fish.
A suggestion to most casters, lay out 4lb mono and break it by bending your fly rod, this is some what hard, if you can, (on a 2w rod) then next time a hook-up happens start with the same pressure and you just maybe shocked how quick that little rod will beat up on a fish !
Most people seem to be frightened to bend the wee little rod hard, why ??

Rod length
There seems to be some funny idea that 2w?s must be short, why ?
Because with length comes the ease of Spey type casts and from there the Roll cast which allows the caster/angler to cover water that was once the home of the spin fisher, areas where there is no space for a back-cast.

Therefore to me, a 7" 6’ min rod length is a starting point, but the little 6 footers are really only play things that just don?t win the day, where as a 7 foot?ish plus rod allows the caster to generate line speed that is necessary in overhead casting to beat the wind.

Kind regards,
UB

14

Umm…the difference in a one weight line and a two weight line is not 100% as you suggest, but 20 grains. A one weight weighs 60 grains give or take 6, and a 2wt weighs 80 grains give or take six.
http://www.flyfishusa.com/lines/choose-line-home.html

By your math, an 1wt is one time as heavy as an 0wt, and as we all know, the 0wt line is 54 grains and a 1wt is 60 grains. That is hardly the same, which 1x would indicate. There are also 00wt and 000wt rods, but those rods have not been mentioned yet. I would LOVE a 00wt rod for bluegills and longear in creeks.

If you are fishing a 5 pound or lighter tippet, there is no need to toss a heavy rod. Using a 4 weight or higher for 5x or less tippet is a waste of the rod, as you cannot use it as efficiently. 4 and 5wt rods are intended for 2x-4x tippets and flies from a 4-14 or so, but can toss larger and smaller. 2 and 3 wt rods can toss #8 through #24 flies with no big deal. I can throw size 8 streamers without much of a problem on my 2wt and 4# tippet. If you play fish correctly, you can land big fish (say 16" trout and bass and larger) faster than with a heavier rod and the same terminal tackle.

You have heard of Stu Apte landing a 100# tarpon on a 6wt, right? That is along the same lines as the eight pound bass on a 1wt. Do you think that tarpon was able to be released healthily? ABSOLUTELY. If you utilize side pressure and maintain a shallow rod angle to the fish, using the reel, your fish will come to hand in short order and be in great shape.

Jerry Siem of Sage fame, the creator of the SPL, SLT and TXL ultralight rods, has stated that the tip of the rod, which most fly fishers use exclusively with a high stick fighting method, is the WEAKEST part of the rod, and is intended to load quickly for casting, and to protect the light tippet from the surge of a fish, and to cushion the hookset. The midsection is only there to transmit power and feel from the tip to the butt and vice versa, and the butt is the section of the rod intended to do the fighting. By maintaining a shallow angle to the fish, you let the butt section be the main part of the rod doing the fighting, rather than the tip.

Thanks for playing guys! From reading the other thread, we have some folks on here that are adamantly for the party line of 5-6wt rods, and we have a couple who are ultralight aficionados, and yet a couple more who are curious of the ultralight advantage. I was pleased with the other thread, and this thread has me watching eagerly!

Thank you Uncle Barry! I was typing when you were, and I am thankful someone else sees where jkurtz and I were coming from. I can lay the sticks to a good fish on my 2wt and whoop it quicker than I could with a heavier rod and similar terminal tackle.

15

Should anyone tell Gem that there’s a 000 weight TXL? I can only imagine the whirling durvish of posts it might spawn!!!

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I hope to acquire one of those beasts…I think it would be great with a Lamson LP-1 or Orvis BBS I on it.

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Andy, there is a review of a couple TXL’s on the FAOL product review page.

J.

http://ultralightflyfishing.yuku.com/