I read a fly-tying tip that was saying you could save time by not wrapping the whole hook shank with tying thread and just starting the thread at the back of the fly, Taking a few wraps and start tying in your tail…
Turns out that tip is crap because the thread base is no longer there, there is nothing to protect against material slippage!
SO, I tied up about a dozen or two woolly buggers with this (time saving) tip,only to find that the stupid things slipped after one fish…what a waste of time!
Why hadn’t I figured that they would slip against a bare hook…
well heres a picture of the slippage masterpiece:
anyone else have any tips that didn’t help them that they want to share? (help others from making the mistake…)
maybe you didnt understand the tip. from your quote above you only talk about tying in the thread at the bend of the hook to tie in a tail at not the whole fly! dont blame the tip.
you can tie in by the eye but just spiral the thread back to the bend in open turns.
you can tie in the thread at the bend of the hook and build your fly by wrapping the shank with thread as you wrap the materials forward to the eye.
Talk about time. When I started it was recommended to coat the hook with head cement FIRST! I still do unless I am spinning hair. And I start my thread at the head normally too. 8)
Lord Castwell;
You’re not alone, in the “coating the hook shank with cement first and still doing it”, department. I, too, have been doing that for the past 20 some odd years, too. I make my own cements, so I made a slower setting one, flexible, that works great for this!
A “thin swipe”, down the shank of the hook, then begin the fly. Things “stay put” to say the least and I use far less thread, on each fly, not to mention saving a great deal of wasted time, wrapping all that thread down the shank.
On “Peacock bodies” this method works even better, because I don’t have to use reinforcing copper, or brass wire, counter wound, to keep fish teeth from tearing up the fragile bodies!
I start the thread at the bend of the hook on a lot of flies, especially small nymphs and dries. This helps keep the bulk of the body down and looking more natural. I haven’t ever had one do what yours in the picture did Chris. :?
The trick to starting the thread at the tail and still ending up with a thread base, is to make two or three wraps for each new material tie in point. Once you’ve got all materials on for say a wooly bugger, lay your wraps toward the eye of the hook in tight touching turns. I have used this method, however, I tend to start the thread at the eye, because holding the tag end of the thread allows me to lay a tight thread base from eye to bend in three or four seconds, therefore, eliminating that step immediately.
I think it may be the bead head as well. A fix that will ensure that your bead stays put is to wrap 3 or 4 wraps of lead or tin to the shank and shove it up under the bead. Tag it with CA glue, and it’s not moving. You very well may not be using the right tension to tie the bug either.
Mr. Castwell & Mr. Flybinder… I also come from the years ago school, like J.C. and usually use Fb’s method as described. I say “Oh Yeah” to the peacock herl comments. And… I almost always rub beeswax on my thread 'soon’s I tie it on. I know lots of thread comes prewaxed, and some don’t need wax, but I learned that way 30 some years ago, and I just like it …ModocDan
Yep always start at the eye and work down to the bend AND finish with a Half Hitch.
Don’t use the head cement on the shank any more. but as Bobbin Holders were unknown to me when I started tying. I still punctuate each step with a Half Hitch. Slow No, and if it is, I know the trout don’t care. They just Chomp. Have Fun. jax
I must have read the same tying instructions that Castwell read (he shouldn’t have left them laying around for impressionable, young minds to see). I still lay down cement at the start. My flies tend to hold together unless the materials fail or are chewed apart. They might not be pretty, but it takes them a while to fall apart once they are up in that tree. 8)
Another way to prevent the bead head from slipping, other than adding lead wraps, is to fold over the wire like the eye of a needle. Tuck this up inside the beadhead to hold it in place. Lash the wire down along the shank and use it as the rib. This only works if the wire for the rib is reasonably thick. The extra small ultra wire, for example, isn’t going to cut it. Anyway, I’ve not tried this yet but read it in a book. Looks like it should work, and would be useful in cases where you don’t want to add more weight but do want to ensure the bead stays put.
I know how frustrating that slippage can be - and hard to avoid sometimes. I know what you are saying about useless tips though. Some of them save very little in time or material, how much thread or time would you save by missing on body wraps? Bugger all of either I would suggest, and what would be the value of one inch of thread or two seconds of you time anyway!
On to a glue base - I always used to like doing this as well. I got into the habit when I was a newby to help avoiding the slippage from tying too loose when I was struggling with multiple materials. Later I found that it made the flies almost indestructible, especially with fragile materials of various sorts.
I used to have a ladies nail varnish pen like thing, it was like a felt tip pen with that sort of brushy tip. It was so easy to just flip the lid off, one quick wipe of the fly and chuck it back on the bench. Then I’d wrap and tie as normal over the nail varnish. You didn’t realise how strong it all was until if you made a mistake and tried to cut it all off to start again, it took ages to get back to the bare hook again.
I have never seen those pen things since, I’d love to find one again.
I put down a thread base (side by side wraps) and have no problems with slippage. Thread is cheap, and if put down with the proper tension, will not permit material to slip. I use very little adhesives in my tying, and am a fan of the occasional half hitch. This is important when reaching for a sip of beer and a few Cheetos while tying, so things don’t come undone.
Joe
Any idea why my flies all have an orange hue to them?
I probably over-tie my flies, but they are durable!
The only short-cuts I take are that on some flies (usually foam), it’s hard to do a whip finish, so I just throw a half-hitch or two on it and coat about 6" of thread with Zap-A-Gap, then wrap it and let it set. The I coat the entire head with Zap-A-Gap, then after it dries, with the apropriate color of laquer or hard enamel. Or sometimes I use Hard As Nails.
…ModocDan