Got a question for all of you but before I ask, let me just say that I am not a newbie to either fly tying or fly fishing. I’m a better than average tyer and have fly fished regularly since the age 12. I’m now sixty five. I’ve tyed hundreds of EHCs from #4 all the way up to #20. All my EHC are tied pretty much by the book with a fairly full hackle palmered-body, and reinforced by counter-wrapped fine wire. The other day, I was showing my fly box to another senior fly fisherman who complimented me on my fly selection and the quality if the flies. He then went on to suggest that my EHCs would be far more effective if I cut a V-shaped notch out of the bottom hackle so that the body would sit lower in the water:eek:. I’ve heard this idea tossed around in this and other forums but I’ve never given it much consideration. My EHCs seem to work rather well as they are. What do you guys think about this issue? Do you like your EHCs with or without a bottom notch? Thanks for you input. 8T
I don’t use body hackle at all on my caddis dries. Just a bit behind the eye of the hook. The elk or deer hair keeps the fly floating nicely. Take a look at some Goddard Caddis, lots of deer hair.
8T,
Your question is perfectly valid and may inspire a useful exchange of knowledge. For that, don’t forget the option of experimentation. Try clipping a few. Try them if the fish are taking the others and if they aren’t and see if the result differs.
I don’t notch elk hair caddis but sometimes trim the bottom hackle off of other caddis patterns to let them sit flush in the film like a spent insect. Except for being harder see to I think they work well for casting into back eddies after a hatch or mating flight is over.
I can see the argument for notching some patterns used on slow currents, but the EHC isn’t a caddis pattern I’d choose for this situation. To me, it’s better suited for broken currents. Regardless, there’s enough bulk at or above the centerline of the fly to push the body flush to the surface; by design, it’s not inclined to float on it’s tippy toes. Otherwise, we wouldn’t concern ourselves with the choice of body material or praise the buoyancy of elk hair. But you gotta do what works for you, and I respect that your style of EHC is right for you on the waters you fish.
Was this gentleman a regular fishing companion?..or were you complaining to him about your EHCs? I’m wondering what his reason was for volunteering how to make your EHCs far more effective.
(I will, however, often trim the top hackle fibers to get the wing to lay flatter.)
This is a very interesting question. I tie mine as you do, by the book, but I would only fish them typically in a choppy current because the stay up. For most other water I choose the X-Caddis because the wing stays up and the rest of the body can puncture the water tension on top and ride just below (seems to work well round these parts). Just remember that you can always trim away the hackle stream-side but you can’t put it back on.
I like all of my palmer hackled flies with shorter hackle fibers than what would be considered the norm of 1.5+ times the gap. That means my EWC end up with hackle that is around 2 mm longer than the gap.
No clipping is necessary and they float just fine!
My vote is for keeping them the way they are…they seem to work well for you…so don’t fix it. That being said…You can always tie up a few to cast on your next outing. Looking forward to your update and photos.
My view is that if you have tied that many flies, to tie 6 with the hackle trimmed or much shorter would be no trouble, then try them. Like some others, I would fish the fully hackled ones in rougher water, or downstream so that I can flutter them back up - or at least make them twitch - without them diving or creating a wake. But I would fish the trimmed ones in flatter water or upstream where a more dead drift is needed and I want the fly’s butt so be closer to the surface - or in it. Let us know the results of your trials.
As I stated in the “Biggest Myths” thread, the hackle coming straight down does not help float the fly, therefore it does not float the fly higher. Remember the pin trick? Lay a flat pin on top of a bowl of water - it floats. Place it on the water tip first - watch it sink.
Hackle isn’t hollow either. It won’t float like deer hair.
The fly is supported by the hackle coming from the sides of the hook.
The advantage of notching isn’t to get the fly riding lower in the water (since the unnotched fly is riding that low already). Rather the advantage of notching is to ensure that the fly “cocks” properly when it lands.
A fly is a tool. There is no correct or incorrect, as obviously all the versions as discussed of this fly catch fish.
If the fly you are using is doing the job you want it to, there is no reason to modify it.
However, if you feel there is a reason for such a modification, i.e., you want the fly to sit straighter on the water, you want it to sit lower, etc., then you can ‘clip’.
I’m all for modifying flies or using different ties in different conditions. It’s all about getting the fly to do what you need it to do.
I tend to have both ‘unclipped’ and ‘clipped’ EHCs in my box, but I don’t clip a ‘V’, I clip mine flat across the bottom. I also carry foam bodied versions, longs and short hackled versions, and both hair and poly yarn winged versions. All for specific situations I run into from time to time.
I don’t clip the hackles when I tie them, but occasionally do on stream. Just carry a pair scissors in your vest and if your getting rejections try clipping one.
Thank you for your excellent input on the EHC. It looks like the majority of us are non-notchers. I think that Bugsy makes an excellent point that trimming bottom hackle is not needed in most situations because the bulky wing pushes the fly down in the water and gives a strong body outline already----the EHC hardly sits on its tip toes when tied in the normal fashion. I also omit that hackle on smaller flies (#18 and above). As Bamboozle suggests, I go with a smaller sized hackle than normal on all my EHC. However, I will definitely experiment a little bit, and try some notched EHCs particularly in slower water. For those asking about the gentleman who suggested my EHC needed some additional trimming, he just a passing acquaintance. I was not complaining about any fly to him. I believe that he suffered from the same problem that I and many older anglers share. We are just so full of wisdom and knowledge that when we open our mouth, it comes out uncontrollably. 8T
I have watched many of the Parks Fly Shop tying videos and Mr Wesie does clip a notch on the bottom of many of his fly patterns such as the Clacka Cadis and others. If a profesional guide and tyier like him does this there must be a pretty good reason for it. I have tried to copy his methods as closely as possible because I am sure that he has caught a lot more trout than I ever will and I need all the edge I can get.
