Jim,
That is an interesting observation and very similar to what I am experiencing in some of the water that I fish. It is the clearest I’ve ever seen it and it is amazing how quickly a fish can inhale a fly and spit it back out without any indication to the fisherman. Even when you’re watching it can be hard to set the hook fast enough. It can make for some tough fishing, however you will certainly learn something about the fish we spend so much time chasing.
Jim Smith
Hi Jim,
Yes, it is a new experience for me being
able to see the fish clearly and watch thier
reactions. I can see the draw to the clear
trout waters folks speak of. I feel almost
like a voyeur.G Seeing things that I have
not been privy to all these years. It’s a
real hoot! Warm regards, Jim
This thread has reminded me of some of Homer Circle’s comments in the Glen Lau film “Bigmouth Forever”. He was talking about watching the footage from Lau’s first film, “Bigmouth” and he expresses shock at how many times his crankbait was inhaled and spit out by some considerably sized largemouths, totally unbeknownst to him. To those not familiar with “Uncle Homer”, believe me when I tell you that he was no slouch on the water. I think that regardless of the tackle used, this is a piscatorial habit that is the bane of anglers everywhere. When in doubt… STRIKE! Cheers, Alec
Jim,
Thanks for the link to the recipe. Great looking fly! I’ll have to start bringing a few of those fishing with me!
Most of my crystal clear fishing happens on the upper portion of the Fall River in California. I’ve fished further down but it’s not as crystal clear as the upper portion. It’s very educational to be able to see 15-20’ deep (and depressing when the fat trout sitting there are just laughing at me). 
I’ve literally watched trout move slightly to the side to make room for a wooly bugger to drift past untouched (d’oh!).
I know they’ll chase and sometimes hit small clousers. I’ll have to see if they have an appetite for greenie weenies this summer.
Thanks!
JH, RW here,
Try one of my “rainbow variants”, the four hackle dry fly that I’m sure I sent you awhile ago. I’d like to see how it does on those big southern gills of yours. It works well up here in Yankeeland. If I haven’t sent you any in awhile it’s because Jr. can’t seem to beat Tony. If he doesn’t win much this year I’ll send you some. Heck, I’ll send you some anyway.
Later, RW
“Maybe your stature as a fly fisherman isn’t determined by how big a trout you can catch, but by how small a trout you can catch without being disappointed.” <John Gierach>
Spent about 5 hours at the lake yesterday afternoon [purely in the interest of ‘ahem’ research] fishing two rods. On the 2wt I had the #10 chart popper I’m fond of during the spring. On the other - a 3wt - I had a cream scud under a strike indicator [5/16" foam sphere with toothpick]. Here’s the results:
Total caught - somewhere around 40 [lost count].
Fished the popper more than scud mainly because I like to fish the 2wt rod.
Scud easily caught twice as many fish as the popper! Could only catch one or [rarely 2] fish from a given pod of BGs with the popper. The fish were in shallow and VERY spooky. Oftentimes just casting the popper near them resulted in a “starburst” pattern as the fish scattered. With the scud/strike indicator setup I took 7 BG from one pod of fish. I could anchor the boat, cast the scud out, move it around a bit, pop the indicator to get the fishes attention, and actually fish it almost like bait! As the wind was swirling around that was a major benefit. It wasn’t strong at all but one minute it was in my face, the next off the right shoulder, the next somewhere else. Boat control was a major pain and since I had to keep moving to fish the popper it made it less effective to do so.
A second benefit [for me, at least] was that the number of casts per fish caught needed was cut way down with the scud. I don’t have any idea how many cast one might make in 5 hours of constant casting but it has to be a bunch. The scud simply required fewer casts per fish caught.
Will I give up topwater presentions? No way. Too much fun. But I will be fishing under strike indicators more this year I think. The small indicator shows even the smallest movement of the nymph and I think goes a long was toward identifying the hits Jim was wasn’t seeing. Anyway, it’s one more “bullet” for your flyfishing gun.
tite lines
Donald
Jim
Bravo! Just read through this whole thread. Thanks for taking the time to share your experience with the rest of us.
Like so many others, I rarely get the opportunity to fish gin clear water. But have often thought that a fish can take and spit out your fly without you even knowing it. Your observations confirm this.
I had a similar experience two Saturdays ago catching my first bluegill of the season. I was throwing my 3wt with a GRHE (Rick Z. notice the rod and fly. No 5wt and woolly bugger. G) Anyway, I never saw my line twitch or felt a tug until I lifted and felt what turned out to be a nice fat 9" gil. Now the bass on the other hand were all over just about anything I was presenting to them. Which also confirms what I have always felt, in that bluegills are much more selective feeders. And from what you’ve posted your redears as well.
Cheers!
Every fly fisherman has an unreasonable view of fly rods, and I am no different. Thomas McGuane
Give beer to those who are perishing, wine to those who are in anquish. Prov 31:6
Hi Gents,
I have returned to the area every day
since the clear waters. It appears it was
a freak occurance and our waters are now
strong coffee black but full of fish. I’m
still catching, but it’s a mystery to me
when it happens. I am undoubtedly missing
many strikes just as I noted when I had the
fishbowl clear conditions. Those of you
that have clear water all the time, I am
in envy of you.G It was a neat experience. Warm regards, Jim
Angler Dave,
It was a hoot for sure. I’ll be on the
look out for these conditions next spring
and maybe I can get on them sooner. It’s
a real treat to see what’s happening under
water with your wet flies. Interestingly,
there did not seem to be a particular way
of fishing the wets that was preferred. I
could let it drop and lift it back to the
surface, or I could slow troll the fly or
I could even move it relatively quickly and
the fish were still mouthing and releasing
it through it all.G Warm regards, Jim
Jim
Very interesting. But I am afraid those weren’t my wet flys. At least I don’t remember sending you any. Maybe they were Rick Z’s? What I tie is not worthy of sending out. S
Every fly fisherman has an unreasonable view of fly rods, and I am no different. Thomas McGuane
Give beer to those who are perishing, wine to those who are in anquish. Prov 31:6
Hey Angler Dave,
Obviously I confused you with my response
to your previous posting.G I didn’t mean
that YOU sent me wet flies. I was just
commenting that it is a real treat to be
able to watch the fish take your wet flies.
Or my wet flies or anybodies wets.G The
more I type the more confusing it gets. I
will quit now.G Warm regards, Jim
Hi Jim,
I was off on a camp/fish last weekend. I was drifting some soft hackles and wee wets, neither of which are popular in New Zealand for some reason? Anyway, down stream fishing often results in very noticable “tugs and takes”, but a few times I noticed nothing more than some “pressure” building on the line, as if I picked up some weed on the drift. I tightend up on the line, lifted the rod tip, and sure enough it ended up there was a fish on! I remember being surprised on at least one occasion that there was a fish, or anything, as it was just that suddenly something felt a bit different about the drift.
There were a few spots where the water was gin clear, and I could see the take. The most interesting was after having spooked a nice trout twice with a small dry fly (lined her), I switched to a soft hackle and tossed that up stream of the fish. The fly drifted by, and when the fly was just passed the fish’s head, it turned and intercepted it (ended up being a 2.25 lbs, 18.8 inch rainbow). On a couple of other takes on wet flys where I could see the take, it seemed the same thing. The fish let the fly pass, and then turned to intercept it. These were ususally quite noticable because the fish has to swim around to re-face into the current. So, I figure on the more subtle takes, the fish intercepted the fly before it drifted by, and just moved over, grabbed the fly, and moved back into feeding position, which then means the only signal is the fact the line is now being held and the pressure is that of the current on the line.
Anyway, I learned a lot from being able to see how the fish react. And, I agree, it’s very exciting to see what’s happening.
[This message has been edited by JeffHamm (edited 20 April 2006).]
anlgerdave not using an olive bugger.
Not sure my heart can take the surprise.
Rick
great post, from everyone involved, and thanks Jim for the kick off
I spent this last fall /winter trying to learn to nymph for trout and drove eveyone nuts with the constant question," how do you know when they take the nymph “”
It is such a comfort to me to now know that gills and bass do the same thing. I have experienced the > let’s cast again…opps there a fish on syndrome … too often .
Yesterday , I was out and the gills would hit any underwater presentation reasonably presented but not aggresively and not often. I wondered then it I was having a “mouthing” experience. At least 80% of my casts end up with slack at the tippet so I would indeed never have a chance in that situation.
Great info on the attractant too, many folks think this is un-cool but it is interesting non-the-less. Let’s see , we tie flies to fool and/or entice the fish to take our offering , BUT , we have questions with odor attractants ( kinda like adding flash ? ) … I’ll have to think about that.
Sorry, a bit off topic, but a vivid memory to share.
I was throwing a green weenie as a dropper in a perfect trout pool last year. Water was clear, and I was casting cross stream to a submerged log, hoping for tenants in its shadow. Sure enough, a monstrous 2-inch brown trout latched on. I slowed & paused bringing him in as he swung down-stream to the middle of the pool because it was such a great view in the clear pool with the lowering sun catching him just right. A second or 2 later, a 14-incher joined and looked like he was gonna play the small-fish/big-fish game. But no, he repeatedly tried to take the weenie out of the mouth of my hooked monster. Finally seemed to ID me as more danger than a tree as the pair was only 2 feet down and 3 feet away. I did some very careful quick microsurgery so the little guy would grow up. Wasn’t much bigger than the fly.
As for the weenie pattern, instead of just looping the ‘tail’, I over-twist the chenille and let it double back/twist back on itself. I make them down to a 14.
Hey David,
Thanks for the input. I’ve had some
really good experiences with the green
weenie as a dropper since Smernski
introduced me to it last year. I’m within
about a week of getting serious in my quest
for big red eared sunfish here in South
Carolina and I think that fly will increase
my chances for a new personal best. I tie
mine with about 5 wraps of lead wire and
give the tail loop a tight twist before
starting the body wrap. One bonus to the
pattern is it’s high visability and being
able to see it dissappear when they close
their mouth on it. Warm regards, Jim
Jim: One more post and we can bind this, get a title, a table of contents and a glossary in the back. Oh yeah, you will have to dedicate it too. Just kidding, always enjoy your posts. Jonezee
Jim, I was glad to hear of this. I was fishing from a bridge where I could see the bg’s clearly. I started using a yellow foam spider and caught one bg. After that, they would just float and stare at it. Every once in a while one would mouth it quickly and more quickly spit it out. IF I moved it, they would swim toward it and sometimes bump it a bit but not take it. I switched to a green foam spider, a red foam spider and a grey foam spider, same results. I tied on a cream scud dropper. The same results but looking at the bg’s they would circle around the scud like spokes around a wheel. Again a twitch would make them come running but they would not actually take the fly hard enough to feel or register on the line. I tried a couple of other flies but no sucess. I had thought it was because lots of times they are fished for with hot dogs bits or worms and my flies did not have the right smell. I am thinking of carrying a little bacon grease with me to ‘grease’ up the fly, or at least let it smell a little bit for bg’s. Later in another part of the pond I caught a couple of bg’s by casting close to and parallel with the shore and then doing the twitch, wait, twitch, wait retrieve but it may have been just that I twitched when one was mouthing it.
Jim;
I wonder if the difference in the takes had anything to do with the clarity of the water, and was an anomaly in the way the fish feed normally. In other words, since the water was so clear, they could also see the flies better and were less likely to just accept them as food items, but were at least willing to try them and see if they ‘tasted’ as good as they looked. But then in more ‘normal’ water clarity the fish are more likely to hold onto the flies longer. Too bad we can’t just ask them!
Don
I spent about 3 hours yesterday standing on the edge of a steep bank pestering bedding Crappie with everything I could find.
I even resorted to trying scents, power bait (after 3 hrs in the sun of seeing but not getting a hit, I was willing to stoop to almost anything).
The only thing that got any non-trivial attention was a tiny thin plastic worm that was hunter’s orange (safety orange) color.
Even then, they’d barely take the very tip and not disturb the strike indicator.
As evening settled in, about 6pm, the shadows in the area I was at started creeping in and the number of crappie chasing whatever I tossed went way up, but the number of nibbles stayed pretty even (and very faint).
I even saw a few trout cruise by one at a time. I’m guessing they were window shopping…waiting to see if the fry were ready yet.
I don’t think the Crappie were spawning just yet but they were definitely on their beds (at least the bigger ones) and would protect it from other crappie but didn’t care much about bugs, worms, etc that were parked in their space.
Water temp is 63 degrees F. A week ago, it was 59 but it hit 63 by Sunday and has held there. This week has been pretty mild (except yesterday…we hit 80 degrees and clear skies).
I’ve heard the bass are bedding up on the other side of this reservior but haven’t been able to try them yet (work, life, and a nasty head cold are conspiring against me).
It was still a lot of fun to watch how many crappie would follow a retrieve and to vary the retrieve to see how that changed their reaction.
If I couldn’t see them down there, I would’ve sworn that spot had zero fish.