I have used both Ross and Lamson on salt. When you do your fresh water rinse after fishing, you should rinse your reel assembled. Otherwise, you risk getting some salt into the drag system. This is true of any reel I know. Once you get salt contamination into the works, and this includes the bronze bushing in the Ross, you are going to get corrosion leading to failure. All reels with sealed drags use “O” ring seals to my knowledge. Sage reels are similar in construction (seal) to the Litespeed. When you change spools on the run, especially on salt, you risk contaminating the mechanism. This includes a Ross.
The Evolution has an added problem if you don’t read the instructions and use lubrication which gets on to the one way part of the drag surface. The little plastic spring tabs may not find good purchase in the little notches they have to seat in. Once they start slipping, you should send the reel back to get the parts replaced. If you read their manual, this is an implied risk.
Nothing is perfect. All mechanical elements have flaws and if you work hard at it, you can find them. But both of these reels, and many others too, are highly refined devices that, with with propper care, will give a lifetime of enjoyment.
But I still like the looks of the Ross better. It’s just such a pretty little thing.
Both are good reels. Both have their own unique issues. There are certain “features” on both that I do not like (roller clutch on the Lamson, bushings on the Ross). I was in the exact same boat as you not too long ago.
That’s why I chose a Bauer. Great drag, ball bearings, cork drag, start-up is smooth as silk. They’re basically the same price too. And yes, they’re also made in the USA! Just thought you might want another option to consider. I think the Bauer is the best of the three choices by far. YMMV.
PS - If you’re not too far from one of the Cabela’s stores (Buda should be relatively close to you), it would behoove you to stop in and check out the bargain cave. They ocassionally have fly reels hiding in the display case back there for a lot less $$$ than new, and many are simple returns that had never been used. I picked up my last Bauer in the Ft. Worth bargain cave (a M2SL) for a mere $150, and it was brand new. Even the store clerks couldn’t tell why it was back there.
Since I’m feeling a bit feisty today, I’ll throw in another 2 cents. I absolutely LOVE the aesthetics of the Lammies. And, both the radius AND hard alox velocity are on clearance at Madison River Fishing Co. (no affiliation, just a satisfied customer many times over).
I guess the point is this: there are a LOT of good reels out there that will be up to the task of holding line and having their drags tested every now and again. Find one that suits your price point and has the looks you dig.
I like to think I take my reels to task since I routinely fish salt (flounder, stripers, reds, bluefish, trout), big river catfish (flatheads up to 35 lbs), lake-run browns and rainbows in the Great Lakes, plus pacific NW steelhead and bulls. But I’m not fishing 5wts for any of those species.
I have heard good things about Bauer. Don’t own one. Damn, probably have to buy one now.
I am curious how well the roller clutch works since it does not seem to be sealed. The drag surface is also not sealed. I think it is similar to a Billy Pate which depends on grease to keep the water out. The maintainance procedure seems a bit intense. Sorta like a Pate. Any one else with Bauer experience?
There are a number of reels with roller clutches that have excellent track records, including the Bauer. I know several people with Bauer reels with this design who use them extensively in the salt with no problems.
The reels that I own with roller clutch bearings have never had a problem, some of which have seen extensive saltwater usage for a decade. If submersed in saltwater, they should be flushed out.
Much of what we are talking about in this thread comes down to personal preference rather than any inherent superiority or inferiority of a design. The products discussed so far are all exceptional and likely to perform for a long time, if not lifetime, if cared for or used inappropriately. I wouldn’t my us Ross Cimarron C-2 for tuna for instance, nor would I just toss my Abel Super 11 in the tackle bag and forget it after getting dunked in the saltwater. I happen to have a half dozen Ross reels, along with some Abel, Sage, Orvis, Redington, Teton and G. Loomis models that have seen extensive usage without problems. If someone handed to me a current Lamson or Bauer reel I would be quite happy.
The Bauer roller clutch is not “sealed” in the traditional sense of the word, but it is not exactly exposed either. The clutch mechanism sits inside the aluminum disk below where the cork drag disc resides. You can see a picture of this at the bottom of this review on Tackle Tour. Around the base of the aluminum disc is a close-fitting ring of high-density foam rubber. This may not exactly seal out water, but does a very good job of keeping dirt and sand out. I have dunked my reels more than a few times, and upon inspection of the roller clutch area afterward, have not noted any problems.
Maintenance is not really much of any issue either. Approximately once a year, I take the drag disc off and allpy a very small amount of lubricant (supplied by Bauer) to the rollers (looks to be a lightweight lithium grease or something similar). More often than not, I find that it is not really necessary, but wipe the old off and apply new anyway.
The drag is not really sealed either, but really doesn’t need to be. As long as it is clean when the spool is put on, there really isn’t a way to get anything stuck between the cork and polymer discs.
I have had my first Bauer reel since '96 or '97 (shortly after they came out), and have had ZERO problems with it. Bauer even updated the drag system for me for only the cost of shipping when they made significant improvements on the design (looks like they change $35 for this service now).
PS - The image at the bottom of the Bauer reel care page shows how the reel goes together pretty well.
I read the manual before I installed backing and line on the reel. In fact, that was the only time I removed the spool before the bearing failed. I only used it in fresh water, and only recall dunking it once or twice. I also allowed the reel to air dry for a few days before I put it away. To have the bearing fail after only a couple week’s use was just not satisfactory in my book. After the second failure, I was given replacement bearings made in Germany (out of stainless steel) that were supposed to eliminate the corrosion problem. Two of them! Hmmmmm…no thanks, I’ll just use (and recommend) a reel I have confidence in.
Exactly the problem I had, after I bought three of the things. First time I used the baby one I caught a tiny little mountain fish on my brand new #2 weight and the reel and pieces fell into the stream at my feet due to that exact failure. Bits went everywhere downstream. I got tangled to the crapper and lost the fish of course. I was “mildly annoyed!”
I don’t give a damn what the problem or cause is, fact is a reel of that price, quality and age should not do that, just no way I can accept even a “mistake” like that. They will not be forgiven!
For me, any discussion on drags on a reel for #2-5 weights is arbitrary, it won’t get caned much doing what I do. The Evo is one sweet little baby though and definitely my top choice choice for value and niceness.
They’re both excellent reels, yet just like anything else, they can have problems. I’ve got two litespeeds and they’ve performed extremely well, except for the clicker that broke on my size 4. I have a number of Ross reels, as well. Personally, I like the older Canyon’s, Gunnison’s, etc.,. I have had some problems with the newer ('03 and later, when they changed the escapement) ones, usually involving the drag. I had purchased several models, the first years they came out and subsequently, they had issues. Everything from intermittent drags, to complete failure. Ross replaced them and so far, they’ve worked extremely well.
Someone mentioned the Galvan’s. That’s another one I would definitely check out.
While I do have a Lamson Radius that I fish regularly on my 5 wts., I rarely have fish on the reel anyway (this includes some bruiser trout) so the drag on it rarely gets used. I also have a Ross Cimmaron that I use on my 6 wt. but again, the drag present on the reel isn’t really needed for the majority of the fish that will be caught. Let your rod do the work when your fighting fish, not the reel. You’ll find that you’ll land your fish quicker and they won’t be quite so exhausted when you release them.
now, back to the reel discussion, I love both of mine. the Ross is built like a tank and the Lamson is really smooth…you really can’t go wrong either way.
I’ve got to disagree here regarding the drag being unimportant for trout. I fish several tailwaters here in MO (and Arkansas) for trout. My average trout is probably 14" or so. But on a good day I’ll typically hook (and usually land) at least one 20" or better bow or brown. With a fish like that (usually using either 6 or 7x tippet) a very smooth drag is imperative. I’ve tried cheap reels and with most of them it’s impossible to land a fish like that (for me anyway).
That being said though both of the reels in question probably have a good enough drag for this purpose. I have a Ross Rhythm and it is very good including the drag. I think it has the same drag system as the evolution. But I’ve heard the Lamson’s have an even smoother drag. I guess the question would be - how smooth do you need?
Is it a need or a want? All I really need for a drag is the palm of my hand… but having a very smooth mechanical drag is a very nice luxury (and practical because if allows me to use both hands to control the stick better).
I utilize my drag often… On the Kenai (Alaska), the water is big and the fish are big. The rainbows frequently hit 34" - 36". The 20"+ is simply the average fish.
And besides, when fishing light weight for the smaller guys in smaller water, we are working our presentation right through the middle of spawning salmon, so it is not rare to have to wrestle with one of these guys for a time. This is also the benefit of having virtually no startup on the drag… it keeps the flies on the end of the line instead of instantly popping at the first head shake.
So, can we live without a smooth drag, sure. Is the drag helpful, of course. Does the higher quality drag make a difference, IMO…yes.
I guess when you put it that way a high quality drag could be considered a luxury. But to me using the “palming” method of applying drag has never worked that well except in limited situations. I know it works well for a lot of people though. Probably works best for people that get to fish a lot. But I’m a busy professional and my time on the water is pretty limited.
Size of the fish is all relative isn’t it? Am I envious that a 20" plus fish is the average in your neck of the woods? Sure at least a little. But I’m perfectly content with the challenges in my neck of the woods.
