Perry County Penn. Couple Attack By Black Bear Inside Their Home.

I know these folks. Casual acquaintance. They aren’t stupid but I have to say they could have totally avoided this:

http://www.fox43.com/news/wpmt-perry-county-couple-attacked-by-bear-in-home-20111003,0,5571630.story

This is why we have leash laws folks. Even if you don’t have time to put them on a leash you tie them out so that the dogs over powering instinct to defend it’s territory only gets it eaten and doesn’t put your wife, child, self, etc… at risk! You live in bear country! Keep your critters securely tied up, penned up or in a kennel! I am a dog lover but if the choice is between risking the dog’s life or a human one, sorry pooch.

Not to mention the fact that now a bear, possibly a female with cubs, faces capture and relocation (that never works) or destruction (that really isn’t fair because the bruin did nothing wrong).

I hope the Moyers heal, I hope they learn from their mistake and I think Perry County needs a little enforcement of the domestic animal laws.

Sounds like it was about 1 in a trillion chance of what happened happening.

To me there would be no use owning a dog if every step you took outside of your house you had to leash it or tie it to something. We fish with our dogs all the time and let our dogs play outside with each other at a number of different places and all in semi remote bear country and have never had an incident. We know bears are present and come around at night because we see the prints in the mornings.

I don’t think this couple made a mistake it was just a freak incident which rarely if ever happens. We have had black bear break into homes here in NM and kill at least one person for no reason.

I guess their mistake was cooking up some tasty food…?

Yeah it’s called taking the responsibility for owning a pet. There is nothing that annoys me more than when I am on the water and someone’s pooch is running about, unleashed, uncontrolled, poorly trained and splashing about in the water that I am fishing. I also get annoyed when I am out deer hunting and see some domestic dogs chasing down deer.

Really though comparing Northern N.M. to our are is like comparing apples to oranges. When you live in the east you have smaller counties with higher human populations. Your neighbors are close by, not far away. A sure fire way to get sued is to let your dogs run on my property and cause harm to people, animals or things that are on my property. That is why we have leash laws. When you have that many people living in close proximity to that many bears you take extra precautions because the bears here are sometimes too used to being around humans. Also at this time of the year the bears are putting on weight for their winter sleep so they get a lot more courageous.

That last remark you typed is really out of line. If you want to be a smart@#$ take some advice and do not try it with me. The couple that was killed deserves more respect from you than that too.

I think YOU are going a little over board here Nighthawk. You seem to have some thin skin. I took the individuals remarks for what they were…just conversation. Maybe he didn’t know the story. If you don’t want comments then you shouldn’t put forth articles that cry out for them. I don’t see anything wrong with a trained dog going without a leash at all. On the other hand I have been on the wrong end of an untrained dog ruining my day at Morgan Run in Md.
Just saying…lighten up
my two cents…

Bernie

Let’s keep the conversation civil, shall we.

REE

Oh it was the last line he put in there that got my goat. He was being a wise guy. if I overreacted or you think I have a thin skin so be it. Just goes to show how little you really know about me. I don’t take offense to that.

Also this isn’t like we are talking about hunting dogs here or we are in the act of hunting with a dog. Guess I just care about taking a little better care of my critters than most folks do. Any one who just turns them loose is probably going to have some type of trouble caused by the pet. Don’t you really have to wonder about folks that let their pets just run free? Do they care so little about their pets?

To each their own. We aren’t always going to get what we want but we always get what we deserve in the end. Myself included.

I’m not going to jump in the middle of the loose dog controversy, but does anyone know how you exercise a big, young exuberant dog? Is there a compromise?

you could try riding a mountain bike with the dog on a leash. try asking this fellow:

http://www.cesarsway.com/

really like this guy’s approach to dog training or as he says rehabilitating the dog, training the human.

I too, have to agree with Bernie.
Some important facts are missing and we just can’t “guess” at the answers.
Fact is, Oliver township is pretty small and not too populated. Just a little over 2000 people. Last recorded information is that the county has 8.6 square miles. Newport is the biggest area there but it’s a small burg at that. Looking at the photo of the news report, doesn’t look too populated. 249.1 persons per square mile.
We still don’t know if the bear was female, protecting her cubs or just chasing a dog. I like dogs too and if I have to decide about a dog or a bear…the bear loses.
Leash laws are covered by the Dept of Agriculture—dog law.
Anyone can look this up but the important question here is----Do the Moyers own the land??? Then they are not guilty of letting the dog" run at large". Has to be on property not of your own and furthermore, the dog has to be unaccompanied by owner or handler.
Trapping bears does work. If it didn’t, would the game commission continue such acts if they weren’t reliable and productive? A call to Stevie Hower, your local protector, or call Jerry Feaser, Game commission headquarters and ask them. I know what the answer is. Say hi to stevie when you see him again. He’ll remember me.
You stated that the Moyers could have totally avoided this??? How?? This is not something that happens all the time. Leave the dog inside and have it go to the bathroom in the house? Leave the dog outside and not leave it inside so the bear attacks it and kills it.Thats caring for your pets.

This is an unfortunate accident, an accident that almost never happens. No one is to blame or get cited. No laws were broken. If you have that many bears in your neighborhood, go hunting or invite a hunter to help with the control of the bears in your neighborhood. Lets not point a finger and say whos wrong, lets work on solving the problem and come up with viable solutions.

Randy

I wasn’t trying to offend by any means.

I was just trying to throw out some comparisons about bear attack incidents. We do have a lot of black bear where I frequent and we have our fair share of bear attacks every year. I have also lived in the east for quite a while. I live in North Carolina for 11 years and I know how human encroachment in bear territory can lead to lots of encounters. This is something I was always aware of deer hunting in the farmlands of NC near the towns of Little Washington and Plymouth.

I want you, and everyone else, to know that nothing I said intended to disrespect what happened to this couple (and I do not think I did). If anything I was defending their actions with their dog as not being a lapse of judgement.

But I will apologize to you if you took offense to what I posted. If I offended you with my post this is the best I can offer. You posted a critique of their actions and I responded with my opinion and an example of what happened in my state as a reminder that bear attacks can happen for many reasons. They are unpredictable animals and if we all had to adjust our activities to avoid a potential bear attack then none of us would be venturing out in bear country.

This seems like it is turning into a dog leash law argument that probably did not apply to where these people live, on their property. If my assumption is wrong in this case then let me know and I will gladly retract my critique.

So let’s have a virtual handshake and all is good…

What couple was killed ??

We’re not talking about hunting dogs here, engaged in hunting or training. If people want to let their animals run loose on their own property, that is fine with me. It’s their choice to deal with any consequences which might occur. I work with a neighbor of the Perry County folks who had the bear enter their home. I hope they make a quick recovery, and am thankful there were no more serious injuries.

The moment an UNCONTROLLED domestic animal enters public or another private property where I have the right or privilege to be, it’s not OK anymore. Not too long ago I had a serious injury caused by the presence of an uncontrolled dog loose on a public road. 3 surgeries, months of pain and suffering and lingering pain which will never go away, you could say I don’t appreciate moron animal owners letting their animals run “free”. Even though the animal had a collar/tags and was badly injured, it was never found, nor was the owner located so there was NO ACCOUNTABILITY.

Killed??? Are we reading the same story???

They look just fine to me. Just a few stitches…very minor injuries.

It’s not the first time peoples dog’s have brought them bear trouble…in fact that is a rather common scenario… dog encounters bear… bear gets upset with dog…dog runs back to it’s owner/pack leader…bear chases dog, right behind. (remember running from a predator triggers a predatory /aggressive response) One of the Grizzly attacks in Alaska this year was caused by the same thing.

Unfortunately, dogs will be dogs and people will be people, which means the bear looses in this case unless the guy involved goes the mile and loudly asks them to spare the bear. I won’t hold my breath on that one.

I really do wish you would all try to read the [u][i][b]entire post before responding. The couple that was killed was in New Mexico and was posted by vmabuck not me.

[/b][/i][/u]vmabuck it’s cool and to you I apologize.

As for the rest I live in a more sparsely populated township of Perry County than the folks that had the incident with the bear even though I actually live in town. I know the WCO’s here not on a friendship basis but one of them is my neighbor. Says right up there in the top right hand corner of my posts Liverpool, Pennsylvania U.S.A.

Sure you can let your dogs run on your own property but you do it at your own and the dog’s risk. The instant the dog leaves your property or harasses wild game on your property you are in violation of the law. just ask the fellow in our county last spring that shot the bear on his property because it was after his dogs. Last I knew it was costing him a lot of court time and money to fight being written up for it. I don’t think what happened to him is fair but that is the law.

I am not a current dog owner but have owned them in the past and love them to death. A responsible dog owner will take the time to walk the dog on a leash so it can do it’s business, put the dog out on a chain, put the dog out on a dog trolly line, have a kennel for the dog to run in, have a friend or family member help them walk the dog or pay someone to do it for them. If you cannot personally see to the needs of your pets then it is time ask for help or to give them to someone who can. I am sick to death and tired of seeing dogs like our friend has maimed or killed on the highways because people are raised with the belief that it’s okay to let them run. That is being a irresponsible dog owner. Same goes for those who let their dogs run free in bear country.

Regardless of all that back to the issue at hand. I really do feel for the Moyers and I am praying for them. In my opinion and it is just that only my opinion this whole incident could have been avoided but we live and learn. There are do’s and don’ts in bear country and like the WCO said bears and dogs mix like oil and water. If you want to own a dog in bear country then you accept the risk that Fido may come home with angry bear in tow.

P.S. Oh yeah I forgot I am a hunter. That too has been openly discussed on these boards several times. I don’t hunt for trophies. I don’t hunt what I won’t eat. I don’t like bear meat so I will not hunt them. Those that do I neither like nor dislike. They are on their own.
Ilso relocating territorial animals like bears knowing full well they are most likely to return to their old territory has been done many times by the Game Commission. Even though they knew it was a waste of money.

I am washing my hands of the subject and this post.

… Buck’s post refers to one person being killed.

John

It was one lady but yes, that was me talking about the death of a person in a home invasion style bear attack.

vmabuck it’s cool and to you I apologize.

No problem man. It is a touchy subject sometimes.

This is the old woman’s story:[i]
Bear Kills 93 Year-Old
New Mexico Woman
By Joe Garner

The 100-pound elderly woman didn’t have a chance against a 275-pound bear in the kitchen of her home, wildlife officials point to bears desperate for food as the
continuing cause of people-bear incidents Page 2 of 18

A 93-year-old New Mexico woman was mauled to death by a black bear that broke into her home over the weekend, stunned wildlife officials have confirmed. Adelia Maestas Trujillo of Cleveland, in north-central New Mexico, was killed “by multiple bite injuries,” said Scott Wilson, associate director of the Office of Medical Investigator.

?I’ve never heard of someone being killed in their home by a bear.? ? Don MacCarter, New Mexico Game and Fish Department

Trujillo, a great-grandmother who lived alone, was found Saturday morning, Aug. 18, on her kitchen floor when her son, Raymond Trujillo, came from his nearby home
to check on her, authorities said.

“From our preliminary investigation, she was asleep during the night, when she heard a disturbance and went to investigate,” Wilson said. “At that point, the bear
pushed out the screen door and came at her through the window in the door. There was little evidence of a struggle.”

Wildlife officials said the attack was unusual but shows black bears in northern New Mexico and southern Colorado are desperate for food. Spring frosts and summer drought have killed off choke cherries, service berries and acorns, which make up the animals’ summer and fall diet.

“I’ve been here 18 years, and I’ve never heard of someone being killed in their home by a bear before now,” said Don MacCarter, spokesman for the New Mexico Game
and Fish Department. “But just like in Colorado, we’re seeing bears in the towns and on the highways.” ?Trujillo was an elderly woman who weighed in the vicinity of 100 pounds (and) who didn’t have a chance against a 275-pound bear? ? John Sanchez, Sheriff

New Mexico wildlife officials had been planning a meeting Thursday to deal with bear-people confrontations even before Trujillo’s death. “Her death shows you how
desperate the bears have become,” MacCarter said. Mora County Sheriff John Sanchez said Trujillo “was an elderly woman who weighed in the vicinity of 100
pounds (and) who didn’t have a chance against a 275- pound bear.”

Trackers with dogs found a bear they believe was the attacking animal and killed it Saturday afternoon. The bear was less than a half-mile from Trujillo’s rural home,
which lies on an acre of land in a community of 500 to 800 residents. The animal’s carcass is being tested, Sanchez said.

“You hear lots of different stories that she was cooking, but she wasn’t,” the sheriff said. “We’re still investigating, but the bear might have been hurt and she spooked him.” In Colorado, bears have been seen near malls and schools. As many as 16 sightings were reported in one night this month in Trinidad, Colo., said Todd
Malmsbury, spokesman for the state Division of Wildlife. Bear attacks also have been reported at campgrounds this summer, Malmsbury said, but “We haven’t had a person killed in their home by a bear in the last 100 years.”[/i]

This is not new for us here in NM. this year has been terribly dry and record setting for forest fires. The last I heard we had put down some 145 problem bears this year and it will only get worse in the fall as they desperately forage for that winter bulk. My friend keeps having his bear come closer and get braver and braver. The GFD tried a live trap with no success and they have already told him to shoot it if it comes around again and I agree.

He has three kids and a wife. He has confronted the bear twice now and he is pushing his luck because one of these times that bear will be desperate enough to fight instead of flee…

Ha, Ha you are right John. My bad. Open mouth insert foot. Now there is something I am really good at. :wink:

Apparently the number of troubled bears put down is now just over 200…