This might seem like a strange question:
I recently started using o-ring, yarn indicators. I like that I can easily move them up and down the leader. I’m finding, however, that I can’t get them to stand straight up. They lay on their side, and I’m therefore concerned that they’re causing too much drag.
Are they? And is there a way to get them to stand up straight?
Thanks,
Randy
Randy, your assessment sounds about right. Whenever the indicator lays to one side or the other it usually indicates drag. Can’t say for sure though. That’s why I switched a few years ago to the Thingamabobber indicators. By design, the way you attach them to your leader, they throw a 45 degree bend in the leader which allows the flies to drift at a right-angle to the line above the leader. They work well for me. I used to build my own o-ring yarn indicators and fished them for a long time, I like my new choice a bit better (key on the Thingamabobbers is to use the smaller sizes).
Kelly.
All indicators cause drag. The water at the surface travels faster than where the flies are. So the indicators are dragging the flies downstream and the flies are holding back the indicator.
Think if it this way. For an indicator to signal a strike, there must be tension in the leader between the indicator and the fly. If there was no tension, you would not see the indicator react. Well, tension in the leader is the definition of drag.
The tilt of a yarn indicator can be due to drag but can also be caused by wind or the downstream travel of the indicator as it moves through the air. Any air resistant object moving through air will be held back just a bit by air resistance. Air resistance can tilt an indicator, especially a yarn indicator that is more air resistant than a Thingamabobber or foam/cork in-line indicators. Air resistance will cause the indicator to tilt away (back) from the wind or tilt upstream when traveling downstream in still air.
If the fly or weight catches on the bottom or fish stops the fly, this tilt will reverse and the indicator will tilt downstream. This is a sign of a hit. So watch the “tilt”. A subtle take will cause the indicator to straighten up or change the tilt.
I like yarn indicators in slow flow situations. I believe they are the most sensitive to subtle takes. My favorite is to use a black/white yarn combination. It provides natural contrast. The white is seen well in the shadows and the black is used to distinguish the indicator from white foam. This color combination seems be more natural and I think it spooks finicky trout less than the bright optic yellow or orange colors that are more commonly used.
I would expand on this. Your indicator SHOULD tilt downstream. That way you know your fly (flies) are on the bottom.
Think of it this way…you cast up and across (or straight upstream in the Driftless). Your rig comes down stream. The fly has to move slower than the indicator if it’s ticking rocks on the bottom. Hence the fly will be behind the indicator forcing the indicator to tilt downstream.
Meanwhile, because your fly is hanging up for microseconds as it ticks along the bottom, your indy should be moving more slowly than the current. If your indy is moving as fast as the bubble line, you ain’t on the bottom.
I think the indicator is useful, not so much because it indicates a strike, but because it indicates through its relative speed and tilt whether you’re on the bottom.
Great info. Thanks so much. The yarn is tilting to the side, not downstream. Funny, I just bought some thingambobbers. Can I use them if I’m nymphing straight upstream?
Randy
Assuming you’re fishing up and across…towards you or away?
As Steven has said, a strike indicator is really a “drift” indicator. It is this change in the drift of the flies that “indicates” the strike.
I fish Thingamabobbers exclusively for all of my nymphing whether up, across, or whatever. I like them over yarn because they seem to cast better, and I can see subtle takes a bit better than with yarn, something about that round, plastic bubble that vibrates/transmits movement to the water surrounding the indicator, much like dropping a stone in the water with the rings transmitting outward. Can’t really explain it, just know it feels like I’ve done better since changing to them. I also like the way they cast on windy days, much more so than the yarn indicators. My favorite color is the glow-in-the-dark off-white model - not for the glow in the dark feature, but because the color is subtle much like foam on the water.
Kelly.
I tried using the yarn then the polypropylene yarn ‘O’ ring systems, didn’t like them. I felt they caused too much wind resistance when casting and didn’t float or drift properly, in fact, some sink rather fast.
I liked the foam indicators that had the rubber center and you would twist your leader onto that, but they always seemed to come off and would float on by.
I really like the Frog Hair strike indicators, true they are used only once per set of small rubber snubs, but they don’t kink the leader. However, they do tend to slide sometimes so you have to use two snubs on the fly end of the indicator. Those are my preferred strike indicator when I am fishing on my own.
Most of the guides that I use have switched to the Thingamabobber style indicator, so when I fish with a guide I am usually using those. I like them, but they do put a big kink in the leader. I attended a class put on by Skip Morris recently and he indicated he does not like the kink because it can possibly cause you to miss a hit since the kink is sort of acting like a shock absorber and for you to really see the hit the kink has to be straigtened out somewhat.
When I use the Thingamabobber I prefer to not move it up and down the leader to adjust for depth because of that kink. I would rather adjust the length of the leader, but sometimes you don’t have time to do that.
Larry —sagefisher—
Okay, I know(think) we fly fishers sometimes do or use what’s fashionable. Some of the ‘indicators’ (aka: bobbers) fall into that catagory. They are pre-made, float well, reasonably easy to apply, generally work as intended and, to be honest - cost more than they should given the materials, but that’s okay(see 1st sentence).
Do they cause drag? What item on the water that’s attached to something that’s not on the water doesn’t sooner or later? Of course they do. Some probably more than others due to size, bouyancy, displacement, current, and face it - your(generic) cast. Personally, I think there’s a material out there that works great for unweighted or lightly weighted nymphs or other sub-surface flies. That material is Aunt Lydia’s Sparkle Yarn. I cut white, yellow, orange, and flame red yarn into 2-3 inch long pieces. Oh, this yarn is 3 ply. I keep these in a small zip lock bag. When one is needed I just select the one I want , fold a double looped knot onto the leader or tippet at the height I want, insert the yarn and slide the loops tight. Sometimes I’ll apply some floatant to the yarn. Anyway, the ends of the yarn usually stick up are easy to see, float great, stay where put, and are Very Inexpensive. One problem is if you attach the yarn to a small, 5x or smaller, piece of mono it’ll take a little effort to remove. This yarn is all I use for unweighted trout flies and it works.
Allan
I do.
I use thingamabobbers because they’re one of the easier to cast high floating indicators.
I’m also partial to the micro balls. http://www.umpqua.com/pc-1293-90-micro-ball-drift-indicators.aspx
They don’t cast as well as the thingamabobbers, but I know that when the rubber band coming out of the top tilts towards me, that I’m on the bottom.
FWIW, the only reason I can figure that your indy is tilted to the side is if your indy and your flies are in currents with different speeds.
I’m a fan of thingamabobbers as well. Cast easy, don’t get caught up in the wind, and float nicely. I usually use the smallest size, but do have some 1/2" ones in case of a heavier fly or heavier currents.
Paul
I like the little red and white bobbers you grew up with. they are easy to cast (a little more weight cuts the wind), easy to adjust, stay put on the line, and also have a right angle connection. Plus, the stares I get from the other ffers are priceless…sometimes I even use the Orange and Chartreuse ones.
TOO funny! I’d like to see that. In fact, perhaps I’ll become a convert 8)
Kelly.
I have one of those in a very small… maybe I’ll give it a shot next time I’m dropping a nymph haha
Paul
I tried this once, but it didn’t work. Can’t remember why…I think it may have shattered being whipped back and forth.
I used to read a lot about people using lindy rigs, but not so much anymore.