Male -v- female trout, I just haveto ask....

FAOL Community Fly Anglers Online
1

Read the thread below on how to tell them apart. Apparently, especially with the younger ones, it’s difficult. No one posted a sure fire method, though. Apparently there are ways a biologist can tell easily, but it requires more than just a glance. Time we’d not like to take because it would either kill or seriously stress the fish.

But I have to ask, is there some reason it would be pertinent to know this? Are their habits different? Is one sex significantly larger than the other like with largemouth bass? Again, like bass, is one sex easier to catch? Is one sex more numerous than the other (might make a difference to a keep or release decision)?

I guess my real question would be: Why would this information help an angler on the water?

Thanks,

Buddy

2

My only guess is in picking which ones to harvest ???
Although I know it is the males that guard LM Bass redds. So harvesting them at spawn may not be a good thing.

3

I think curiosity is a good enough reason. There is no dumb question, it might seem pointless to some but I’m sure he has a good reason and even if he doesn’t I don’t see what is wrong with that question.
Thanks

4

With steelheading it is helpful to know streamwise how many hens vs bucks are netted. It was pointed out to me to identify with steelies, that a hens upper jaw, will not extend past the eye. Only the males will extend past the eye. Not sure how to validate that as far as being accurate? But there is a distinction between fish. I’ve always identified hens in that manner. I was of the belief that trout were the same. Mature trout anyway.

5

Martin,

Not criticising.

Just wanted to know if there might be a reason where knowing the difference at a glance would help while fishing.

Curiosity is plenty of reason as far as I’m concerned. I was just curious if there was another reason.

Buddy

6

I apologize Buddy, the last thing I wanted was to sound rude or anything close to it.
Thanks

7

I posted that out of curiosity, and I actually learned a lot along with getting a few laughs. I have seen some large trout in the fisheries, and noticed the large hooked jaw. I actually thought that was related to size, but I now know that it was a large male.

After only two years of fly fishing, I realize this is much more than a sport, and more of an education in life. I learned that every time I compromised while fly fishing it cost me. I learned the value of looking before stepping, listening before talking, and most of all, admitting that I know very little instead of pretending otherwise. All in all, I think I am a better man, husband and father thanks to our shared passion.

And now that I know a little about determining the sex of a trout, I have something I can teach my kids while on the water. I definetly have the amunition to make them laugh when that topic comes up.

Best regards,

Jason (aka. Bedlam)

8

I do know in Bass that the really big one are usually Females. After catching thousands of Pink salmon you can tell at a glance which they are even before the males develope the big hump which gives them their nickname Humpies. In sockeye and Kokanee the Red ones are males the dull brownish purple ones are of course females… Rainbow Trout are easy to tell apart close to spawning time otherwise not so much . Ladyfish are confusing because much like people in Southern California some of those ladies are really guys.
In most baby fish the ones in pink are girls and the ones in blue are boys.

9

The difference is significant for bass fisherman, which is why I asked the question about trout, wondering if the facts were similar:

Some bass sex information:

When bass are under twelve inches, it’s difficult to tell them apart.

Very few male male largemouths ever reach anything over two pounds. A trophy male is around three pounds. Biggest one I ever heard of was around six, and I doubt that one as I didn’t see it.

Male bass out number female bass by a wide margin, something around fifty to one at survival size (about two inches).

Males are much more argessive than females.

Except during the spawn, males and females will segregate after reaching sexual maturity.

Males will group by size. Females will group by sex.

Males show more extreme movements than females. i.e; Males will move shallower and deeper than the females under the same conditions.

Females are ‘smarter’ than the males, for lack of a better word. They tend to be more wary, faster to flee, and harder to catch. They also live longer than males.

Why all this matters to the fisherman:

If you are catching little fish, 10 to 12 inch ones, the vast majority of them are males. If you are going to keep and eat fish, these are the ones to catch and kill. These are also the ones that most fishermen do catch, as creel surveys nationwide show the average largemouth caugth by anglers averages right around 12 inches.

If all the fish you are catching are about the same size, but larger than the juveniles, from a given area, it’s likely that you have found a school of mature males. This means that you may catch more of the same size fish, but it’s not likely that you will catch a larger one in this spot. If size matters, you’ll need to move to another location and try to find females.

If you are catching good fish of differing sizes, you are likely fishing a group of females. Stay there. The opportunity for a good fish is high.

If you are catching males very shallow, a move a bit deeper may put you on the large females. If you find males very deep, a bit shallower may find the girls.

You’ll never catch as many females as males.

Bass are very like humans in some things ;).

Buddy

10

Buddy, @your basic question…one minor reason for me was…we were planting triploids which supposedly are all female…not really true but close enough…so in a local fishery if we caught a male we pretty much assumed it was not a triploid.

11

@ Ducksterman, what are triploids?

12

bedlam, i googled it it and found this… Triploid fish look, swim, jump, and taste like normal fish, except for one important difference—they never develop normal eggs or sperm and are unable to reproduce (i.e., they are sterile).

13

for id purposes these pix show the difference.
http://www.trophytroutguide.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=1

for the steelhead waters i fished in the northwest usa sex wasn’t as important as determining wild vs hatchery. wild were to be released, hatchery were ok to harvest.

14

Triploids grow larger than normal since they don’t use up energy trying to reproduce.

15

Sounds like they got married.

16

My first laugh of the day:lol::lol:.

17

If a normal trout has chromosomes in pairs, they are diploid. Species which have their chromosomes grouped in quartets are called tetraploid. Species whose chromosomes are in groups of 6 are called hexaploid. An animal whose chromosomes are in groups of three are called triploids. Since chromosomes are usually grouped with half coming from the mail and half coming from the female, individuals with their chromosomes in odd-numbered groups are usually sterile. There are some abnormalities where a single chromosome of an diploid animal might be in a cluster of three, these instances are probably not considered triploids (genetics class was a LONG time ago).

To confuse the issue, different species of the same genus need not have their chromosomes in similar groupings. For example, there are diploid, tetraploid, and hexaploid species of wheat.

Ed

18

I suspect fly fishing (and yes tying too) have the largest numbers of absolutely useless information than any other endeavor. So there, I said it and I’m glad.:lol:

19

asked this exact question about small stream trout this weekend to the Head Fisheries Biologist of Wisconsin at a fishing show was at. He said trout have no obvious identifiers in anal port.

20

Assuming the “useless information” response was in response to the triploid question, it’s useful information, at least in my part of the world. Out Dept of Natural Resources will only allow triploid fish to be stocked in many systems. That way, in case they change their minds at a later date, the fish won’t have established themselves via natural reproduction, and can be removed by merely ceasing to stock. (The same reason they stock only tiger muskies in Maryland.)

It makes getting permits for Trout in the Classroom much easier if fish to be raised and stocked are triploids.