I agree that lighter is easier on the wrist but longer is MUCH easier on the elbow. When I started favoring my 10ft 5wt my elbow problems vanished. They return when overhead branches force me to my much lighter 6ft 4wt. All that said, I have noticed some wrist pain with the 10ft lately but then at 72 most joints hurt a bit>
Good luck to your pal and Tight Lines
Now I cut my eye teeth with an 8’ so I’m prone to favor that length. Although my rods range from 7 1/2’ to 8’ to 8 1/2’ to 9’ - and 4 to 9wt. It’s not that I have not tried shorter and longer and lighter and heavier, but for me this is what fits and works best. And I’m not a long distant caster - probably 15 to 30 footers are my main stay and this is where I catch most of my fish. Have had to make longer casts to be sure, but that would be the exception and not the rule. Further more, a 5wt is my personal favorite, so much so that I have three 5wts, an 8’, 8 1/2’ and a 9’ - of these three the 8’ (IM-6 mid action) is the easier to cast, for me. And I have some of that arthritis stuff to contend with, too.
Rheumatoid Arthritis (assuming that’s what ails him) is an auto-immune disease. What happens is that your immune system attacks the joints/bones where the cartilage attaches to the bone, it eats it away for lack of a better way of putting it.
Essentially, you have constant inflamation in the joints or bones that are affected. Some days it is more noticable than other, depending on how much inflammation he has in the affected joints/bones. If he has it in his wrist then he will probably have a difficult time finding anything that eliminates the pain completely.
A few folks have mentioned wrist braces, I think something like that will probably offer him the most comfort while casting. Anything that stabilizes his wrist is going to minimize how much motion there will be. Minimizing the motion will minimize aggravation to the affected joints/bones.
For about 15 bucks I think he would do well with the Wulff wrist brace, or play around with some other braces before he spends any money on new rods.
Send me a pm with his number if he would like to talk to me about it, and I’ll give him a call.
TT.
Not a lot was said about balance which greatly affect the amount of effort required to fling the fly line. A little extra weight on the reel end might reduce effort on the wrist. I know the bass fishing folks sometimes add weight to the butts of their casting and spinning rods, they will probably make a lot more cast than a fly fisherman and all of the effort is in the wrist.
Technique will also affect the joints, it seems to me a good technique involves more elbow and shoulder than wrist. The Wulff wrist brace limits the effort at that joint and requires better technique. Getting to where the double haul is an almost automatic part of the delivery also requires less effort on the rod hand.
just have him get away from these rocket launchers they call fly rods these days and get him into a nice older (or new) glass or bamboo rod. They literally cast themselves. And, as mentioned, technique. While I don’t ever have joint pain after a day of fishing, I do notice that I’m a bit more tired when I throw the 7wt fast graphite cannon vs. when I throw my nice and easy casting Fenwick FF857. besides, it’ll throw just as much line anyway…and easier. Even in the wind, it just requires so little effort to cast.
I did forget to mention other than the RA which primarily has decided on my hands and wrists, I also have a bad shoulder from a rotor cuff injury years back. Also I worked in several fly shops and did cast most any and all rods we sold including Scott, Sage, Winston, Diamondback, T&T, and St Croix to name most of them. Length, “did,” matter as did rod stiffness and these were the two primary factors working against me and my casting style. It was much more pronounced in the heavier weight rods as I mentioned above with the most glaring example was when comparing the 9 ft three piece Sage RPLX against the lighter, two piece, 8’9" Sage RPLX. Lighter weight, shorter rods and a softer action is what it takes to keep my joints happy. A great example of how a soft action or even a soft tip helps out ailing joints was with the old BL5 Twelve Weight from Winston. It’s very soft tip allowed me to cast i as I would a 9 or 10 weight with little discomfort under continuous casting. However along with it’s very wsoft tip, it was a very light 12 weight also.
Store bought fly rods by manufacturer’s come with one handle grip shape and diameter size, one size does not fit all, and most fly anglers suffer for this in their casting! The most important aspect of the fly rod is the handle grip matching the hand grip diameter size and shape of the person casting the fly rod.
The handle grip of the fly rod, must match the hand grip diameter and shape of the hand. If the handle grip is too small, then the tendons and muscles in the hand and arm tighten, reducing the casting speed of the arm movement. I learned from being a pitcher in baseball that the more pressure you apply to the baseball, the slower your arm motion. As a golfer I learned early the importance to hand grips to be able to hold the golf club in my hands without having to use a tight grip to keep the golf club from slipping out of my hand during the swing.
You want as much surface area of the inside of your hand grip to be in contact with the handle grip. You should only need to apply the slightest pressure to the handle grip with your hand to keep the fly rod secure during the cast.
I also learned as a pitcher when playing base ball, that the arm is for controlling the trajectory of the thrown baseball, the speed came from using the whole body rocking motion during the cast to supply the energy that is transferred to the fly line. If you only use arm motion you will end up with a slower arm motion and control of the cast, and sooner or later end-up with tendinitis. If you are casting right-handed, the left foot should be slightly ahead of the right foot. If you are casting farther, pickup the left foot off the ground to extend the casting motion, and increasing the energy transfer to the fly line for the longer cast.
Another thing that reduces the energy transfer from the arm motion to the fly line, is flicking the wrist during the cast. The only time for flicking the wrist is as the fly line is being placed on the water surface. A good example for learning the flicking of the wrist at the correct moment, try flicking a paint brush wet with water using your casting motion against the outside wall of the house, all the water on the brush should hit one spot on the side of the house, if the end result is a long ribbon of water you are flicking too early.
[ul]
[li]Have The Correct Size and Shape Handle Grip.[/li][li]Don’t Flick Your Wrist.[/li][li]Rock The Body During The Cast.[/li][li]Short Distance, Short Casting Arc. Long Distance, Longer Casting Arc.[/li][/ul]If you do not know what your Hand Grip Diameter and Hand Grip Shape is.
I wrote an article for FAOL over 10 years ago, when I built my first custom fly rod (it was a FRC Gatti 6 weight 9 foot)…“Rod Building: Determining Hand Grip Shape and Size” ~Parnelli
PS: There is no such thing as a balance fly rod and reel! As line is taken off the reel for the cast the balance of the fly rod moves. Ideally with all the line on the reel, the balance point should be near the front end of the handle grip. The weight of the reel, acts as a counter weight to the motion of the cast.
Steven,
I agree with you that there is no such thing as balance when discussing fly casting. I quote one of the greats of our sport, from his finest book.
"In 1889 R. C. Leonard, a tournament caster, stepped to the platform without a reel on his rod and simply coiled the line at his feet. With that abbreviated rig he proceeded to smash all existing distance records, including his own, by a wide margin. It was a shocking thing to competitors and spectators alike. It was a momentous discovery from which not only tournament casters but fishermen as well should have profited. That early-day pioneer discovered an extremely important principle in rod dynamics. It amounts to this: That the caster must move the useless weight below the hand as well as the useful weight above the hand; that the removal of dead weight below the hand helped to overcome inertia more quickly, increasing the tip speed, thus imparting a greater velocity to the projectile or fly line. It should have been a valuable lesson to everyone, but it wasn’t. It remained only among the tournament casters for many years.
If you examine the books and catalogs of those early days you will discover that manufacturers and fishermen-writers discussed very learnedly and extensively such things as ‘fulcrum point’, ‘counterpoise’, ‘balancing the fly rod’, and ‘letting the rod do the work’, none of which has any merit whatsoever. Not until very recently has there been an awareness of this valid principle. It is evidenced by the availability of numerous fine, very lightweight reels on the market today. In view of this trend I should not be discussing this subject at all, except for the fact that I am frequently surprised by the comments of writers and the recommendations of suppliers or manufacturers prescribing a specific size and weight of reel to balance a particular rod.
There can be no such thing as balance in a fly rod. There can never be a fixed ‘fulcrum point’. Every inch that the cast is lengthened or shortened changes the alleged balance and every unnecessary ounce in an unnecessarily heavy reel dampens and degrades the cast. If you wish to explore this a little further, you can try an experiment as I did some years ago. If you have or can borrow enough reels, let us say in two-ounce increments, all the way from the lightest, about two ounces, to something about eight or nine ounces, you will have enough to make the experiment. Use the same weight of line on the same rod for all trials. With the lightest reels the casts are sharply and cleanly delivered flat out with enough velocity to turn over the leaders. You also get a tighter front bow if you want it. As the reels get heavier there is a noticeable lagging in the forward loop until finally with the heaviest reel there is decided dropping of the loop, and probably a failure to turn over the leader properly. This effect is most pronounced on long casts. And consider how much worse it could be with those reels that were manufactured with a hollow arbor into which the purchaser was urged to pour lead pellets through a little trapdoor in order to correct the balance of his fly rod!
You can suit yourself about these matters but for me there is only one sound system and that is: Use the lightest possible reel of good quality and adequate capacity no matter how long or heavy the rod may be . . . ."
~ Vincent C. Marinaro, “In the Ring of the Rise,” Crown Publishers, Inc., New York, copyright 1976, pp. 39-41.
That is why I use the lightest rod in my price range and the lightest fly reels. I want a tip light rod and reel. When I am nymphing, even with some line on the water, the rod and reel naturally assumes a tip up position and I don’t need to force the rod tip up as I follow the drift. The second thing about " balance" with a fly rod is that one can always change the hand position on the rod grip to a more acceptible “balance”, unlike a spinning rod where our hand position is fixed on the grip.
Steven,
I agree with you that there is no such thing as balance when discussing fly casting. I quote one of the greats of our sport, from his finest book.
"In 1889 R. C. Leonard, a tournament caster, stepped to the platform without a reel on his rod and simply coiled the line at his feet. With that abbreviated rig he proceeded to smash all existing distance records, including his own, by a wide margin. It was a shocking thing to competitors and spectators alike. It was a momentous discovery from which not only tournament casters but fishermen as well should have profited. That early-day pioneer discovered an extremely important principle in rod dynamics. It amounts to this: That the caster must move the useless weight below the hand as well as the useful weight above the hand; that the removal of dead weight below the hand helped to overcome inertia more quickly, increasing the tip speed, thus imparting a greater velocity to the projectile or fly line. It should have been a valuable lesson to everyone, but it wasn?t. It remained only among the tournament casters for many years.
If you examine the books and catalogs of those early days you will discover that manufacturers and fishermen-writers discussed very learnedly and extensively such things as ?fulcrum point,? ?counterpoise,? ?balancing the fly rod,? and ?letting the rod do the work,? none of which has any merit whatsoever. Not until very recently has there been an awareness of this valid principle. It is evidenced by the availability of numerous fine, very lightweight reels on the market today. In view of this trend I should not be discussing this subject at all, except for the fact that I am frequently surprised by the comments of writers and the recommendations of suppliers or manufacturers prescribing a specific size and weight of reel to balance a particular rod.
There can be no such thing as balance in a fly rod. There can never be a fixed ?fulcrum point.? Every inch that the cast is lengthened or shortened changes the alleged balance and every unnecessary ounce in an unnecessarily heavy reel dampens and degrades the cast. If you wish to explore this a little further, you can try an experiment as I did some years ago. If you have or can borrow enough reels, let us say in two-ounce increments, all the way from the lightest, about two ounces, to something about eight or nine ounces, you will have enough to make the experiment. Use the same weight of line on the same rod for all trials. With the lightest reels the casts are sharply and cleanly delivered flat out with enough velocity to turn over the leaders. You also get a tighter front bow if you want it. As the reels get heavier there is a noticeable lagging in the forward loop until finally with the heaviest reel there is decided dropping of the loop, and probably a failure to turn over the leader properly. This effect is most pronounced on long casts. And consider how much worse it could be with those reels that were manufactured with a hollow arbor into which the purchaser was urged to pour lead pellets through a little trapdoor in order to correct the balance of his fly rod!
You can suit yourself about these matters but for me there is only one sound system and that is: Use the lightest possible reel of good quality and adequate capacity no matter how long or heavy the rod may be . . . ."
~ Vincent C. Marinaro, “In the Ring of the Rise,” Crown Publishers, Inc., New York, copyright 1976, pp. 39-41.
That is why I use the lightest rod in my price range and the lightest fly reels. I want a tip light rod and reel. When I am nymphing, even with some line on the water, the rod and reel naturally assumes a tip up position and I don’t need to force the rod tip up as I follow the drift. The second thing about " balance" with a fly rod is that one can always change the hand position on the rod grip to a more acceptible “balance”, unlike a spinning rod where our hand position is fixed on the grip.
My friend asked me to thank everyone for their help and time in responding and I thank you as well, it was all very interesting and helpful.
I used to think there was something to be said regarding a balance point, now I’m not so sure. Two seasons ago I started to fish with a fixed length line (no reel).
There is no counter weight/balance below the hand. The rods weigh about 2.5 - 3.5 ounces, pretty comparable to a rod with a reel seat. Even though there is no counter weight/balance, the reel rods feel VERY light in hand, almost to the point of seeming weightless. Of course the total absolute weight of the rod sans reel is about half the combined weight of a rod and reel/line/backing, but again the entire weight of the reeless rod is out front. The lightness in hand may be due to the fact that they are indeed very light in mass, not sure I can quantify it, only know what I feel.
One of the first things that struck me when I started to fish a fixed length line system is how fishable said system would be for anglers new and seasoned who might be recovering from a problem which results in a loss of arm strength or mobility. The casting motion itself is very smooth, delicate, and subtle.