So last time the guy was talking about how everyone should fish with bait because it works better and now he’s talking about proper catch and release methods and complaining about folks holding fish for pictures and stuff.
Unbeleivable
You missed his point!
I think his article was spot-on. Good medicine for fish and fisher.
For sure he was right. I have seen way too many people “manhandle” (what an apt word, that one) fish and expect them to live. Bait may work better to catch the fish but if you want them to live you need to treat them with at least a modicum of respect.
What’s your point?
you being a “guide” according to your profile, should appreciate the article.
look I appreciate treating fish gently and what not, but when the fish swallows the hook because you are fishing with “fish perfume” (bait) it doesn’t matter how gently you handle the fish the fish is gonna die. Holding a fish for a picture isn’t gonna hurt the fish.
“Holding a fish for a picture isn’t gonna hurt the fish.”
RUBBISH !
This fish in almost all cases, will also die !
Normally it takes about 3 day for this to die a slow death.
But as a Guide, your long gone and your customer is happy.
BUT… your income producting fish is or will be dead.
I have to call rubbish on the absolute statement the fish will be dead in 3 days.
I’ve caught the same fish multiple times over the same year. There was even one catfish that had an abnormal tail that I caught at least 10 times over a 2 year period.
There was a brown that had a very unusual pattern of spots that I caught several times over a summer. In late summer, I saw it hanging on a guy’s stringer. No problem there, the guy was going to have some fine eating.
I did take pictures of that trout before it was released. I KNOW it did not die 3 days later.
I always make sure my hands are wet before I pick the fish up.
So, saying the fish will die within 3 days is absolute rubbish. Some MAY die but it sure is not all.
Jeff
Is this an age old proven fact? Even if the hands are wet and the fish is just pulled above water to snap a quick pic? I don’t want to open a can of worms here…lol I just was thinking about all the fish that has to be released and they do get touched by human hands even in the best conditions this happens in order to get the hook out, not always and barbless hooks and all that, but in alot of cases this is the case…
Here again not to open a can of worms, I was just sitting here wondering…
For Senior Grubb and others with an interest in fish mortality rate.
Go to Google and type in “Catch and Release fish mortality rate”.
There is a wealth of information on this subject.
Tim
If those darn fish would just learn to lay still:rolleyes:.
I just read Bob Boese article. I applaud Bob. More should be done to get the word out on proper C&R. To be honest, most people do not know proper C&R. The future of fishing is in C&R and somehow information on C&R is hard to come by. Yes the internet has made it easier to find, but still their are millions who mishandle fish because they don’t have the first clue of what to do. In my opinion, C&R should be taught as a prerequisite to a getting an annual fishing license. A 15 minute course once a year is no big deal, but it sure would be a big deal if reduces the mortality rate of fish.
Just MY $0.02 worth.
Very few absolutes in this debate.
If you use scents on your flies, that doesn’t mean you will kill more fish. You may kill less. Depends on lots of other things. (For those that want to turn that issue into an ethics discussion, grow up).
If you take a picture of your fish, that doesn’t mean it will die. It might, it might not.
If you are very careful, do everything in your power to preserve the life of each and every fish you hook, that doesn’t mean they all will live. Some will die, for reasons beyond our kin.
If you pay little attention, just get the hook out and let the fish go, that doesn’t mean the fish will die. Some fish will live, some fish will die.
If you use very light tippets and have to play the fish a long time, that doesn’t mean that every fish will die. Again, some will survive, some won’t.
If you kill and eat your limit every time you go to the water, that doesn’t mean that the resource is suffering. The reason they put ‘limits’ in place is to keep the population healthy. Sometimes NOT taking your limit hurts the fishery.
Fish die from our intervention in their lives, regardless of how careful we are. That’s the one fact that is not debatable.
For those who care deeply about fish survival, you can learn everything you can and try to apply those lessons to keep the fish from as much harm as you can. Or, if you really ‘care’ about the fish, stop fishing or use flies without hooks.
If you are not overly concerned, do what you are doing. It’s not that large of an issue, and certainly not something to chastise others about.
It’s up to each of us how we handle this issue. As long as we remain within the law, then there is no ‘right and wrong’ here. It’s a personal choice.
Buddy
Barbless hooks is/are a MAJOR step to successful C&R. I don’t have the stats but I’m guessing that if you have to muscle the hook out of a fish jaw, you’ve substantially sealed the fate of that fish.
Mark
There is information somewhere that claims barbless hooks cause a higher mortality rate because they more easily penetrate the brain or gills…or something to that effect. I now don’t know which is best. Perhaps a barbed hook that has been pinched down is actually the hook with the least mortality rate?
Anywhooo…some people mis handle fish just because they don’t know. I for one did until I learned. I fished for bluegill as a kid and they don’t have a mortality rate. Trust me. I even took them home in a bucket and put them in a little muddy colored pond and they were still there the next two years. They actually changed color.
I also helped Game & Fish trap and survey fish. We had bass in tubs of water and they did not look like they were doing well. On way to boat dock I was working with them to try to keep them alive. At boat dock G & F patiently measured their length, weight and put them back in the water. As soon as they hit pure lake water they took off like sonar. So it didn’t appear to harm them at all.
Point is this. I was totally unaware of how sensitive trout are to being handled. So I am mis handling them because of lack of knowledge. I may look like the bad guy on the stream but I just didn’t know. I am actually probably more sensitive to this issue than others. I never carry a camera…although I am starting to think about doing so…and never carry a tape measure. I netted trout I landed and got the hook out and let them go. I did not know about wetting the hands first. But I care enough that any fly that I see that a fish takes deep into the gullet…I won’t use that fly again. Now that is being careful.
So don’t be too quick to condemn someone…it may be that they are just unaware of how sensitive trout are compared to other species. Just help educate them. I know…some are untrainable.
Gemrod
Sorry people,
I cannot understand how a photo is more important than the life of a fish.
What am I missing ?
Catch a fish on a line.
Its is under stress
Under stress fish ph levels go up in the blood
and…
NO, YOU don’t want to know do you because a photo is more important.
Why is this photo so important, don’t people beleive you want you say you catch ??
Take a stressed fish into the air and hold it with your hands wet or dry or with wet cotton gloves that fish has about 30seconds.
It will die in or up to 3 days.
ok, try this next time catch your fish, and the moment it comes to hand…
the vey moment,
(no don’t wait for the camera to be ready)
lift it from the water and take that photo,
within 30 seconds
and then release the fish into running water,
all the while holding the fish till its strong enough etc…
It might help the fish.
A suggestion, if you must prove something with a paper photo.
The moment the fish comes to hand, hold your breath
and
release the fish
when you must take another breath
free, not attached to a hook or line or in a net.
Some people might not have discovered it yet,
You might not have see it yet, the best photo is the image of the fish in the water thats locked in your mind.
If you want a photo, kill and eat the fish.
Kind regards
UB
I like eating fish also.
I don’t want to be argumentative but I really would like to see the raw research data on this as well as see the money trail regarding who funded the research.
If the mortality rate is so high, how do we explain the frequency with which the same fish is caught multiple times in a given season? Yes, the multiple fish caught is emperical data based on limited sample size, but I’ve done it, I know people who have done it, and I’ve seen threads on multiple bulletin boards discussing catching the same fish.
Now, if a person holds the fish out of water for five minutes, of course it’ll have a lower chance for survival. If you squeeze the guts out of the fish while trying to handle it or otherwise cause undue physical harm, it will reduce it’s chance to survive.
However, a properly handled fish, as has already been stated, may die and it may not. Fish die all the time from natural causes.
For about 15 years, I bred and raised tropical fish (cichlids) and sometimes a few of my fish would be belly up for no known reason. On the other hand, I came in my room one day and found one of my big Oscars laying on the carpet. He, yes, it was a male, had somehow jumped out of the aquarium. He fell about 3 feet to the carpeted floor. I don’t know how long it was there but it was still alive, although no longer flopping around. I put the fish back in the aquarium and he floated to the top. I tried to revive him but it didn’t look good. The next day, he was swimming around. That fish lived another two years and continued to be one of my breeders.
So, based on what I’ve seen, being out of water for the 30 seconds or so it takes to snap a photo is not necessarily condeming the fish to death.
If there is primary research out there to prove otherwise, I would love to see the raw data and the methodology of the study.
Again, I’m not trying to start an argument, I really am curious and would like to see the data.
Thanks,
Jeff
Hi Jeff.
in your case.
“I came in my room one day and found one of my big Oscars laying on the carpet. He, yes, it was a male, had somehow jumped out of the aquarium. He fell about 3 feet to the carpeted floor.”
The fish had NOT BEEN stressed by fighting for its life on a fishing line.
To help some people understand where my thinking comes from.
My eldest son is working in the live fish export trade.
Basically, he catches fish and and these are exported and must arrive on the exported to market in about …well up to 20 days these fish must be alive and very, very healthy.
Dead fish cost him big dollars, therefore everything possible has been learnt, tried and applied to keep all their fish as healthy as possible.
AGAIN, it takes about 3 day for a fish to die AFTER it has been caught on a line, if handled incorrectly…
and that includes the wasting of time (of a fishes life )taking a photo.
I guess I do have a bit of understanding of the factors involed, it could be said 
Kind regards,
UB
I honestly think, that its time for everybody to sit back and ask themselves,
Am I a meat hunter and must kill every fish ?
Is this fish too nice to catch only once ?
Do I care about fish and where I fish ?
Do I care about this fish more that the photo ?
I did some many years ago.
You you decided to kill a fish, thats ok, as that is your business and nothing to do with mine.
BUT
Think, did you hear tales of long ago, where there were big fish where there are only small fish today ?
Why, think could I help in some way.
I did.
Some might have noticed,
its only in the last 20 years or less it is a must to photograph all your fish.
Before that it was rare to take photos and back then there were more and bigger fish available to the average fisher.
Just an observation. Years ago, fish were kept for eating as well as bragging rights. Hence, with conservation concerns, came catch and release. The thought was, take a photo and release the fish to live and be caught another day.
I don’t know about trout but I do know there have been extensive studies regarding bass, tournaments, taking the fish to the weigh-in, mortality rate, etc., etc,. Done properly, not a problem.