The batch of gear I bought recently included an Oddyssy vice. Never having used a rotary vice I thought I would try it. The vice rotated away while I was putting the hook in leaving a booby trap in the carpet. Things didn’t get any better after that. The arm was in the way when I tried to tie off material that was put on using the rotary feature and I had way to much thread out from putting the bobbin in the cradle. I did manage two fishable wooly buggers which is about as good as I ever do. The second one looked a little better so maybe I can learn. How long does it take to get accustomed to one of these. Should I just admit that I’m a dinosaur who can only use a fixed vise?
I think it will take a few days to get used to it. I do not have a full rotary vise, but my vise will turn easily the way I have it set. I have it where you can spin it with your finger if you want to. I have really been wanting to try out a Barracuda vise…and see the difference between the regular, and the Indexer, and the Ultimate Indexer. Since I am doing good to have the vise I have, I will just have to dream of having a better vise…lol. I guess I need to buy a lottery ticket once a month or so.
rc,
If you have the desire to tie rotary, especially full rotary, you will need some patience. Especially if you already tie fixed vise. We use a Nor-vise and love it. After several years tying rotary, we STILL find new proceedures and short cuts.
Someone needs to help me here…I cannot think of the name of the vise nor the name of the sponsor here other than Mr Beatty (Al and Gretchen Beatty of B&T Products). They promote a GRAND rotary vise of composite material (Dan vise) that does a grand job AND they have a video of proceedures for rotary tying.
One other thing…get a retractible, spring bobbin (Ekich Automatic Bobbin). It will save you much time and frustration.
…lee s.
300-400 flies! :D;)
Yup the Dan Vise. Though it is a great starter vise and for the money is a little tough to beat I also found I outgrew mine much faster than I hoped.
Steve
Jim,
it will take a little while to get used to it… Once You do You will Love the Konveenyunce;)
RC,
I’ve had a true rotary vise for about twelve years.
I’m still finding things it will do that a stationary vise can’t.
Like any new tool, you’ll need to get used to where stuff is and how your hands have to move to accomplish the same stuff. You’d have to do that with ANY new vise unless it was a duplicate of the one you already have.
But, if you want to use the rotary feature, and many fly tyers, probably even most of them, who have a rotary vise never use it to even half of it’s potential, you’ll need to learn some stuff.
If this is what you want to do, then I’d recommend Al and Gretchens book or video. It will get you started and you will be amazed at what such a tool can really do if you use it.
Buddy
I started on a staionary vise and then
moved up to an inexpensive rotory vise.
I now tie on a Peak rotory vise. The rotory
function does take time to get used to but
it does make a lot of tying jobs much
easier so be patient and give it chance.
I think it will only take about 20 flies. There are a few new things to include in your routine if you don’t already know them, and then all will be fine.
[ol]
[li]Place the height of the bobbin holder so the thread comes off the front of the hook and over the bobbin holder in a straight line.[/li][li]Arrange the bobbin holder to be only about an inch in front of the hook eye for whatever size fly you are tying, and don’t have the bobbin hang too low.[/li][li]Ensure the tension of the bobbin holder on the vise shaft is loose enough that you can flick it out of the way with the middle finger of your bobbin hand as you take the bobbin off the holder.[/li][li]Ensure the tension on the vise (for rotating) is loose enough that you can turn the vise with one finger, and tight enough that the fly can stay ‘sideways’ if you want (handy for laying down the first thread wrap).[/li][li]Us the material clip whenever possible for holding ribbing or any material that will be wrapped ‘second’ (or third).[/li][li]ALWAYS make a half-hitch and put the thread on the bobbin holder before rotating the vise to wrap material.[/li][/ol]Make 20 Wooly Buggers or GRHEs and you should be good to go, just refrain from wrapping material the old way whenever you catch yourself doing it and the new routine will be second nature soon. I am now at the point when sitting at a (someone else’s) stationary vise to demonstrate that I reach for the rotating crank that isn’t there.
Great ideas Greg. I am going try them on my vise.
m
Thanks guys. I’ll play with it some more tomorrow and try Greg’s suggestions.
Hi Rainbowchaser;
If you’ve tied a considerable time with a fixed vise, why not just lock the rotary function of the vise and get used to the vise in general? Once your comfortable with the new vise, slowly incorporate the rotary functions in to your tying. Perhaps start by using the rotary function to tilt the vise to allow attachment of material to the hook easier and also observe the fly from different angles while tying to insure proper material placement. Once you get used to tilting and rotating the vise for more “normal” vise functions, I think you will intuitevely see what you can do with the rotary functions.
I know when I’m tying a new pattern repetitively, I tend to discover ways to incorporate rotary functions into tying that pattern that make it easier and faster.
You may also want to look on Utube and look for patterns tied using rotary functions.
Wayne
I always enjoy picking Buddy Sander’s mind when it comes to Rotary tying. One of the few guys that actually uses the feature on a regular consistant basis. If you go to a large fly tying show, you will notice that many of the tiers have expensive vises that they just don’t use the rotating feature for anything more than looking at the off side of the vice occationally. I think that is a huge mistake, but since most of them came from stationary vices I see why they do it that way. My first, second and third vices were all rotary and I use the rotory features more than anyone in my local tying group. In addition to Al Beatty’s book and video I also own Dave Holt’s video which is very good as well.
Use you tube to help you with ideas for free. This is Dave Holt doing the little brook trout fly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Q_txo44zvI&feature=related
While this guy could have used more rotary techniques in this tie, he does palmer the hackle and rib using rotary techniques: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zN5_RPHvkSs&feature=related Again, use YouTube.
This is the book, you can also get it directly from the BT website, this is just the first link that popped up: http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Rotary-Fly-Tying-Techniques/Al-Beatty/e/9781571884183
I want to be honest with you. To learn the new techniques you WILL BE SLOWER to begin with but the effort will lead to time saved down the road. Then the other truth to the equation is that while many things can be done with rotary technique not all things done rotary are faster than the standard way. I have not been able to save any time by laying down the base of thread with the rotary function vs laying down the base of thread by wrapping thread in the standard way by rotating the bobbin even though Al Beatty is his book promotes this way of applying a thread base. Maybe my Rite bobbins should be Norlander Auto bobbins, but I still think that I can spin the bobbin faster than I can spin the handle on the vice.
Rick
Personally I don’t think there is enough years in my life time for me to get used to those new fangled things!
I’ve seen people do amazing things with rotary vises.
For me they are counter intuative , but all I tie is trout flies.
Jim
While this guy could have used more rotary techniques in this tie, he does palmer the hackle and rib using rotary techniques:
Yes, he could have used the rotary technique for wrapping the dubbing too.
Personally I don’t think there is enough years in my life time for me to get used to those new fangled things!
I’ve seen people do amazing things with rotary vises. For me they are counter intuitive , but all I tie is trout flies.
I also only tie trout (and bass) flies, but they are more even, tidier, and I break or lose the grip on fewer times/materials using the rotary vise. I believe that if you can get on to it they will improve a person’s tying (along with using a magnifying glass & light).
Same here,Jim—I sold mine before I could “get used to it”. I tie trout, bass and saltwater flies.