Glo Bug Yarn tranlucency vs. McFly Foam

Fly Patterns
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1

I tie thousands of flies per year, but help me, I am terrible at tying an egg with glo bug yarn. It’s hard to get round, and I always end up with the thread showing through the yarn where I tied it onto the hook. So, I’ve started using McFly Foam, and my eggs are near perfect. Keep in mind, I am tying size 18-22 eggs most of the time.

On a recent visit to the fly shop, they had only glo bug yarn and no foam, so I was forced to buy the glo bug yarn. The shop owner said he may buy some Mcfly Foam, but he likes the way glo bug yarn looks when wet. Have you found this true? The material itself looks more translucent, and more crinkled than the foam, and I can see where it looks different. Is it that big a deal? Thanks,

Jude
Late to bed,
Early to Rise,
Guide all day,
Tie more flies!
www.customflys.com

2

My thoughts:

  1. The color of glo-bug yarn I use looks, to my eye, exactly the color of the eggs I am trying to imitate. I have some mcfly that is darn close. Wet they both look about the same to me. I really really think the fish don’t care that much.

  2. Size doesn’t matter. I tie on 2457 #12s, and use them everywhere I fish (including the SJ). I’ve watched fish eat yarn indicators the size of golf balls. I have never seen a fish egg the size of the flies I tie, and yet the fish eat them.

  3. Round doesn’t matter. None of mine are perfect, yet they seem to work fine. Close, yeah, but close is one swipe with the scissors, maybe some fine work as the scissors get dull.

  4. Fish do not know what thread is. If it is a concern, use thread the same color as the material.

  5. I agree, glo bug yarn is harder to use on smaller flies (see #2), but I really hate mcfly foam.

Dennis

3

I like the look of the glo bug yarn better, at least when it’s wet. It’s not a huge difference, but it does a look a bit more…translucent, I guess.

As an aside, I’ve found that creating tiny eggs using a dubbing loop to create an even more realitstic and translucent egg pattern. As with most things fly tying, there’s probably no need to go this far, but these really look good when they’re wet. Really, really good.
[url=http://www.charliesflyboxinc.com/flybox/detail.cfm?parentID=27:75a1e]http://www.charliesflyboxinc.com/flybox/detail.cfm?parentID=27[/url:75a1e]

4

The reason your are liking the foam is most likely becasue it is easier for you to cut so it gives a better end profile.

If you really need to have that bottom section of the hook engulfed in yarn then you have two options:

  1. Add a section of yarn to the bottom
  2. Use more yarn on top.

As the density of the yarn increases, the tighter the egg becomes and the more it will “poof.” Teh drawback is that it will also become more bouyant and behave less like the real thing.

I tie them very sparse–on purpose, and the steelhead I angle to and guide to do not care.

I think the yarn has a better appearance when wet and holds it’s shape better. Strong thread, minimal wraps (jam knot, 3 tight wraps to secure, lift up the yarn and 3 tight wraps to finish, then whip and snip), and very sharp hair-stylist scissors are the keys.

5

Thanks everyone for your great replies. DG, I like your thoughts. It reminds me that I over think situations some times, and give the fish too much credit. However, I do think the smaller eggs work better on the Juan in shallow water or where the fish have more time to see your offerring. Why do you hate MfFly Foam?

Ligioner,

Sweet link. Thanks a million. I’ll be tying some up to try.

Loren,

You’re right about the glo bug yarn being harder to get round, but there’s also a problem with glo bug yarn being more bulky at the tie in point, and not compressing as much at the tie in point. This leaves me with that characteristic slit on top where you see the thread. What can I do to eliminate that? What do you disslike about McFly Foam? Thanks,

Jude
Late to bed,
Early to Rise,
Guide all day,
Tie more flies!
www.customflys.com

6

I am wondering why you are using #18-#22 hooks? What type of eggs are you imitating?

My suggestion would be to up the hook size and use a very strong thread (Kevlar and dedicated scissors just for the thread)and really make those wraps tight. I think a #14 hook is about right for a trout or sucker egg imitation.

Fly foem is not that bad, I just think yarn holds it’s shape better. Aside from that, sue whatever works best for you.

7

Loren,

Have you ever fished the San Juan River? We RARELY use anything larger than a size 24 down here for 20" Trout. It’s the nature of the beast. These fish see literally thousands of size 24-28 midges pass their noses every week, and usually won’t flinch at a larger fly. The same can be said for most eggs. The actual trout eggs that I see on the Juan are about a size 20, and a light cream orange color.

Do you think yarn looks better in the water than foam? Thanks,

Jude
Late to bed,
Early to Rise,
Guide all day,
Tie more flies!
www.customflys.com

8

“I do think the smaller eggs work better on the Juan in shallow water or where the fish have more time to see your offerring.”

Jude, on the Frying Pan (tail water), size 20 - 22 eggs are a must for me. On Freestone rivers like the Colorado, or Roaring fork, size 16 - 14 seem to work a whole lot better.

As far as thread color goes, I only use red thread. I start the thread at the eye of the hook and lay a base all the way back to the barb. I then tie my egg in the middle. To me, using red thread makes it unecassary to have a red dot on the egg .

I use Mcfly Foam, and Egg Yarn, and I cant see where the fish prefer one to the other. I personally prefer McFly Foam, as it is easyer for me to tie my flies with.

At one time, I was a little anal about my eggs being perfectly round. Now, I dont worry about it, and the local fish are still hitting those darn eggs.

I have a hard time getting some of the McFly foam colors I like. My local fly shop (Western Anglers)has stopped carrying this product. I asked the owner why. He replied, “Mcfly Foam floats like a cork, and you cant detect strikes very well with it”. I go to Sportsmans Warehouse now, as they carry a few colors of McFly Foam. For colors i cant get here, a friend picks them up for me in Denver.

PS I have started tieing my Egg Yarn patterns with this procedure. [url=http://www.akflyfishers.com/fom_McFly_Egg.html:26bc4]http://www.akflyfishers.com/fom_McFly_Egg.html[/url:26bc4]
I secure the yarn with 4 wraps, then 4 wraps in front, 4 wraps in pack, then 4 around the post, then whip finish.

[This message has been edited by DUB (edited 07 January 2006).]

9

Nope–I’m not a San Juan angler so you obviously have some local dilemmas to deal with. Yuck! The trout and steelhead I fish for ignroe the hook to a larger degree so I can tie trout sized eggs on larger hooks.

I do think the yarn looks better, the foam is easier to tie with. You cannot be delicate with them or they do not work out right. C. Craven’s dubbing loop egg is probably what you really ought to be using on hooks that small. They are a nice tie of you have really finicky fish…unecessary time expense if you don’t.

10

I understand the small insects of the San Juan having fished there in the past. But, why would the natural fish eggs be small (er) than other places? If that is what you are imitating.

11

I don’t know why? Maybe because of the water temp, or the type of trout stocked? The natural eggs are that small though. About the size of a 1/8 bead.

Jude
Late to bed,
Early to Rise,
Guide all day,
Tie more flies!
www.customflys.com

12

I think the size 20 egg patterns I tie are fairly close to the size of the eggs I have seen from trout, and White fish. Heck, my size 16 egg patterns are twice the size of Pautzkee(SP?) Salmon eggs .

Are trout eggs larger in other areas?

[This message has been edited by DUB (edited 07 January 2006).]

13

“We RARELY use anything larger than a size 24 down here for 20” Trout."

You might not, but it has been a LONG time since I fished the SJ with 24 and under flies, and I have absolutely no problem catching fish there. Not even my midges are 24s any more, for the most part, and they seem to work fine for me. But then again the only midges I fish there are dries to the risers, and it is not exactly rocket science to pick out a fish, time it, and put a decent imitation in its face.

I think that very few people there actually TRY using anything other than what their guides, buddies, and the shops tell them will work. The glo bugs I use have grown over the years, since I have seen no difference in bite rates with the smaller ones vs the larger ones, but I would a whole lot rather have a #12 hook there when a steelhead eats one. I do very well on mine on the Juan, thank you. My eggs come out around 8mm, usually, and the fish seem to be perfectly willing to eat them, in three inches or three feet of water.

They do make smaller glo bug yarn, you know. Or you can split it into two pieces, with some patience. Like Mr. Williams, I tie using two pieces of yarn (side by side in my case), and trimming with good scissors. Kevlar thread is a godsend.

I don’t like the mcfly foam because it has to be pulled apart into strings before I tie with it, and I can crank out yarn eggs by the dozens without thinking much about it.

14

DG,

I have no doubt your flies will work since it seems like you fish them with a great presentation. However, I guide the San Juan over 100 days a year from winter through summer, and 95% of the people would do much better on the San Juan with small, non-descript midges with 6x tippet nymphing. It’s not just the guides and a person’s buddies telling them what to use. Take a stomach sample, or a sample of the insects present in the river, and you’ll find 90% of them size 22 or smaller.

I am going to try the larger eggs though because if they work, I’d rather have the larger hook. Thanks,

Jude
Late to bed,
Early to Rise,
Guide all day,
Tie more flies!
www.customflys.com