Florida Exotics (with pics)

Fishing Warm water Forum
1

One of my favorite things to do is hit Interstate 75 and drive a couple of hours south to The Everglades. I have a number of spots that I fish where I can catch largemouth bass, bluegill and the exotics: oscars and Mayan cichlids.

If you’ve never caught the exotics on fly, you’re missing something that is really fun and exciting. Both species are extremely strong and fast.

Oscars and Mayan cichlids like to hang out around structure. They love fallen trees, root systems, rocks, docks, etc. Key is to cast as close to the structure as possible. When the fish hits, it’s your task to get it away from the structure – if you can. This is where you’ll lose a few flies and fish.

Last spring, I took Capt. Mark Phelps, a saltwater charter guide, down to the 'Glades. And I laughed like crazy when he broke off three world-record size oscars in a row. They just tore him up. I said to him, “You don’t have any trouble with a 125-pound taron on fly, but these little fish tear you up!”

We usually begin with No. 10 poppers. We’ll switch to my Myakka Minnow when the topwater bite slows. It’s not time to leave when the topwater bites stalls.

One my favorite places to fish in along Alligator Alley. Three members of the Mangrove Coast Fly Fishers (http://www.mangrovecoastflyfishers.com/) and myself made the drive last May and we lost count of how many fish we caught. We estimated a conservative 500 fish.

Our rods of choice are 2- to 4-weight rods. The fish aren’t leadershy, so I beef up just a little so that you can wrestle them away from the cover.

For those who haven’t experienced oscars or Mayan cichclids, I can only describe them as bulllies. They’re extremely strong and can put most bass to shame. And their plentiful.

Both species probably entered the system in the 1950s. What likely happened is a south Florida aquarium enthusiast was getting ready for a move and dumped the aquarium fish in the backyard canal or pond. The rest is history.

This is a typical Everglades oscar. The fish, which weighed more than 2 pounds, was caught by Paul Drewry of Michigan.

2

My little brother and I used to have an aquarium with oscars in it when we were kids. We used them to test new fly patterns (hook points cut off, of course, I mean, they were pets after all). I always wondered what they’d be like to catch in the wild. My brother is going to Florida this spring to finish his military career and retire there. Perhaps I’ll finally get to find out. The ones we had were in a 100 gallon tank and got to be the size of the one in the picture. Talk about aggressive, wow!

3

Many yrs ago I had an aquarium with two Oscars. I was amazed that those fish actually had bad attitudes. One day my last remaining Oscar ate the green frog in my tank and the Oscar turned green.
Thanks for the pics!
Doug

4

Steve,
I can not agree more with your assesment of Oscars and Mayan cichlids. Last winter we had a couple of hours to fish Alligator Alley. My son Nathan landed a 5 lb Bass on his 4 weight. It was his biggest bass ever on a fly. But, he said the bass became a “wet rag” after 1 minute. The highlight of the trip was the fight of a 2 lb Oscar and the couple of 1 lb Mayans. The best description I can give about these cichilids is that they fight as hard as a blue gill only they are 3 times bigger. I thought blue gill tore apart my foam flies easily. These cichlids ripped my sturdest foam flies apart as if they were butter.
caribe

5

Yep. Unlike Bluegill, they do have teeth. I go with my fishbud down to Ft. Lauderdale once in a while when he decides he wants to fish Alligator Alley and we catch the Oscars and Mayans as well as LMB and a few Bluegill. Oscars are a blast on a little 4wt. I’ve found that Oscars are not too discriminating about what they bite. Most any surface or subsurface fly. I usually also use small yellow poppers or foam bugs and Minnow Crease Flies, sometimes hairbugs and the like. For subsurface, small black Woolly Buggers, Crappie Candy (or similar minnow type flies), and other small wet flies. I would tie some of those Myakka Minnows but I tend to get lazy and prefer more simple to tie flies that would work if I can get away with it. :smiley: I try to stay away from messing with epoxy unless I have to. LOL But the Myakka Minnows would for sure be more durable (contending with toothy fish) with the epoxy overcoat. Thanks for the post, Steve.

6

That is one muscular-looking fish. Sounds like a ton of fun. Compare it with a very large bluegill from around here:

7

Steve,

Are Oscars and Mayan Chiclids good to eat?

That Oscar looks like a boss bluegill with knobby mud tires for super traction. No wonder they can fight so hard!

Joe
"Better small than not at all.

8

The book I have on Florida game fish say the little guys are supposed to be kind of tasty, but the ones I had were pets, and you just can’t do that to pets, even the ones that look like they’d have really thick fillets.

9

If the “typical” Oscar is 2-lbs. or more (like the one that Steve’s buddy Paul caught, in the photo) then it stands to reason there’s even more of the little ones swimming around. “Little” being…what? 1 lb.? That’s not little in my book; not for a panfish!

That’s one cool-looking critter. It’s gotta be a gas, fly rodding for them. And if the smaller ones are good table fare, so much the better!

10

Joe,

LOL. I really would not call them “panfish” unless you know any “panfish” that have teeth. They are called exotics in Florida because they come from another country and don’t belong here. You have to go south of Lake Okeechobee to find them because the temperature gets too cold for them further north to survive.

Some folks eat them I’m sure but I don’t keep any when I catch them down south for fear of high mercury down there in those Alligator Alley canals. Since they are exotic and don’t belong here, there is no bag limit on them. Here is what the FWC (Florida Wildlife Commission) has to say about them:

OSCAR (Astronotus ocellatus)

COMMON NAME - Oscar

DESCRIPTION - Young fish have wavy white and orange markings on black background; body and fins of adults with olive blue-green and mustard colors, highlighting large dark blotches, and a bright red eyespot at base of upper caudal fin; stout more oval body shape than native bream; some have orange or red markings and all have a thick mucus coat on the body.

RANGE ? Most abundant in canals of water conservation areas and Everglades habitats of Collier, western Miami-Dade, Broward, and Palm Beach counties. Occurs throughout south Florida, but typically not as abundant as in marsh-related canals. Native range includes the Orinoco, La Plata, and Amazon river basins in South America.

HABITAT ? Most successful in canals running through marsh habitats, although found in lesser numbers in coastal canals, ponds, and lakes in from central Florida southward.

SPAWNING HABITS ? Spawning normally takes place on flat, solid surfaces when water temperatures warm to 82-91oF; female typically lays about 3,000 eggs and both parents occasionally seen guarding hundreds of young in shallow water along shorelines.

FEEDING HABITS - Feed primarily on small fish, insects, and crustaceans.

AGE AND GROWTH ? Two-pound fish are considered large. The IGFA record caught in Florida was an exceptional fish reported to weigh 3.5 lbs; oscars caught in the Everglades average 10 inches and 3/4th of a pound; biologists do not know how long oscars typically live.

SPORTING QUALITY - Hard-fighting, panfish-type fishery; especially popular in water conservation areas of south Florida, where it ranks second in popularity only to largemouth bass; strikes a variety of baits including cut fish, cut shrimp, crickets, and worms; best artificial baits include small jigs tipped with cut bait and small spinnerbaits; flyfishing also productive; described as a boom and bust fishery since periodically experience major winterkills but when abundant, angler catch rates are exceptional; no bag or size limits.

EDIBILITY - White, flaky meat with good flavor.

STATE RECORD - State record is 2.34 pounds caught in Lake Okeechobee (see state records for updates).

MAYAN CICHLID (Cichlasoma urophthalmus)

COMMON NAME - Mayan cichlid (freshwater snapper)

DESCRIPTION - Broken lateral line and turquoise ring on the tail are diagnostic; general coloration includes 6-8 bars that can be faint or dark; body color varies greatly in intensity sometimes with bright red on the chin, throat, and breast; has both spiny and soft dorsal fins and a rounded caudal fin.

RANGE - First recorded in Florida Bay in 1983, now established and abundant in south Florida as far north as Lake Okeechobee and the St. Lucie Canal. Native to Atlantic slope of Central and South America.

HABITAT ? Very adaptable and lives well in variety of habitats including canals, rivers, lakes and marshes; tolerates wide range of salinities.

SPAWNING HABITS ? Nest building primarily occurs in April, followed by peak spawn in May and June; both parents guard young for up to six weeks; generally spawn once per year.

FEEDING HABITS - Consumes grass shrimp, small fish, snails, and insects along with some incidental detritus and vegetative matter.

AGE AND GROWTH ? Largest measured by Commission scientists was 12.6 inches and weighed 1.5 pounds, but may reach larger sizes as the IGFA world record is listed at 15 inches and 2.5 pounds; maximum reported age is 7 years.

SPORTING QUALITY ? Sometimes referred to as the “atomic sunfish;” takes variety of natural baits including live worms, grass shrimp, crickets, as well as almost any small artificial, particularly jigs, fished on light tackle; wooly worms, small streamers, and popping bugs used by flyfishers also taken aggressively.

EDIBILITY ? Good; white, flaky meat with mild flavor; no bag or size limits.

STATE RECORD ? N/A

11

That’s one heck of a bluegill. I won’t knock them at all because I love to fish for them. Oscars and Mayans play in a different ballpark. They’re stronger and faster in my opinion. You realize instantly that you’ve got a different animal on the end of the line when you hook one of the exotics.

But I will tell you what, Big Bad Wulff, I’ll trade you a Florida exotic trip for a Tennesee big bluegill trip any time! I don’t get 'gills like that!

12

I’m glad you had a chance to fish for them. While state fisheries biologists here aren’t particuarly fond of the exotics, I really like them. They’re great fly-rod fish and are everything you want in a freshwater “panfish.”

I’m constantly amazed by them when they take my fly, run back into the structure and break my leader. They’re so strong and fast.

Several of the places I fish have oscars of world-record proportions. Unfortunately, IGFA doesn’t have tippet-class records for Mayans. I’ve petioned IGFA to do so, and maybe it will some day?

BTW, I landed a nice bass down in The 'Glades last May. A friend of mine, Dave Shugol, held it while I took a quick photo. The fight on my 3-weight was decent, but not quite like a big oscar or Mayan.

Here it is:

13

Yes, they are pretty good. No, I don’t keep many. As someone stated above, we have a mercury problem here in The Everglades. You have to limit your consumption. Once a month would be fine, but I don’t keep them anyway.

Oscars are thick and heavy-bodied. Wouldn’t take many to make a decent meal.

I have never eaten a Mayan cichlid, but I suspect they’re pretty good.

14

[quote=“dixieangler”]

Yep. Unlike Bluegill, they do have teeth. I go with my fishbud down to Ft. Lauderdale once in a while when he decides he wants to fish Alligator Alley and we catch the Oscars and Mayans as well as LMB and a few Bluegill. Oscars are a blast on a little 4wt. I’ve found that Oscars are not too discriminating about what they bite. Most any surface or subsurface fly. I usually also use small yellow poppers or foam bugs and Minnow Crease Flies, sometimes hairbugs and the like. For subsurface, small black Woolly Buggers, Crappie Candy (or similar minnow type flies), and other small wet flies. I would tie some of those Myakka Minnows but I tend to get lazy and prefer more simple to tie flies that would work if I can get away with it. :smiley: I try to stay away from messing with epoxy unless I have to. LOL But the Myakka Minnows would for sure be more durable (contending with toothy fish) with the epoxy overcoat. Thanks for the post, Steve.[/quote]

Hey, Dixie, we need to get together to fish. You’re in my “neighborhood!”

15

Wow those are some nice lo0oking fish. I would not mind tangeling with a mess of them. Oh wait a minute, they have teeth? Watch them fingers. :lol:

16

Teeth, you say? What kind?

Raspy, like a channel cat’s? Pointy, like a pike’s? Razor-edged, like a pirhana’s? Or something entirely different?

No teeth are evident in the photo, but the camera wasn’t looking inside that fish’s mouth, either. Just curious.

Sorry to be such a pest here, but that’s a cool fish. I’d heard of oscars, but only seen the pet store aquarium itty-bitties. Never suspected they could grow to fishable size.

17

I would have to say they are kind of tiny pointed teeth. I have not and don’t intend to put my finger in their mouth to find out. LOL Enough teeth to tear up a fly pretty bad unless its epoxied. I use a hand towel to grab them and probably shouldn’t but they have a real thick slime coat and I could not grab them any other way because they are so slick. No chance of lipping them either with the teeth unless I used some fish grippers or pliers. LOL

I think that’s because you live closer to the coast. Toward the center of the state they seem to be bigger. I used to fish some canals in Port Charlotte and some ponds along I-75 near Sarasota once in a while and I would catch a lot of Bluegills but they tended to be mostly small. I don’t know why they seem to be bigger inland and smaller near the coast but they do. But I suspect it could be an available food supply issue. We have some really nice sized bream here toward the center part of the state. Unfortunately, the current drought situation we are in with low water seems to be causing the fish to bite very little or not at all right now.

Probably two hour drive for me over to Sarasota or you to Sebring. Send me a PM and we can talk about it, Steve.

18

I’m taking a friend to The Everglades on Friday (weather permitting). He’s a longtime flats guide down at Boca Grande. This guy has caught tuna on fly, bones, permit, sailfish, you name it. But he’s as excited as a 5-year-old on Christmas morning at the thought of fly-fishing the exotics.

If he wants big oscars, we’ll head for some canals just southeast of Naples. If it’s numbers of fish, we’ll go to the canals along Alligator Alley.

Hopefully, I’ll have a decent report and photos by the weekend.

19

Steve,

Don’t give us a report. Write a story or two for FAOL’s Panfish or Warm Water column! You can do it!

Rick Z., me and the other contributing non-trout writers, we need help. It’s winter here and we’re out of ammo!

Attention fly fishers in southern-tier states: It’s time for y’all to keep up the spirits of us snow and ice-bound folks.

Joe
“Better small than not at all.”

20

Joe,

You have a PM.