Friends:
What is the relationship between the size of a dry fly and the size of the dropper nymph to be attached? How far apart should the dropper be tied, and what tippet lengths should be employed? I’m trying to get some “rules of thumb” here. What is the knot for the dropper?
Thanks for your comments amigos,
Migs
Hey there Migs:
As is often said " it’s all relative". My droppers are usuall very dependant on dept of water and current speed. It seeems however that I use 18" for most of MY situations. The dropper cannot be of a weight that would cause the primary dry to sink. I usually fish with small “stuff” so the ratio of dry to dropper is critical but then I expect to entice a bite to either presentation. If you’re using the surface fly as an indicator ONLY, it’s size matters less as long as it floats with dropper attached.
Great article by the way.
Mark
I’d rather be in Wyoming!
First of all thanks for the remark on the article! Its my first so I have to gage response in order to see if a future one is warranted.
As for the dropper, 2 ft sounds good enough so I’ll try it. How do you get them not to tangle (I guess its just luck???) Or can luck be slanted in the casters favor?
Migs
Migs,
Generally if you are having some trouble with it tangling, you can open your casting loop, slow down, and rid yourself of the issue.
Don
PS, keep the articles coming!
There are quite a few different ways of rigging the dry/dropper rig. The distance from dry to nymph can start as short as 9" and be as long as you are comfortable casting. I would never rig one more than 30", personally. I generally use the shorter rigs when the “nymph” is either an emerger or can pass for one. I commonly fish a Emergent Sparkle Pupa about a foot away from a dry that is functioning mostly as an indicator. We’re I to bother with the source of frustration known as a trico, I would probably do the same thing with an RS2 and a parachute. For a small weighted nymph, I would make that dropper longer, to gain depth.
As far as the knots go, this is a source of great debate. I generally find that the more the knot setup allows the flies to move freely, the greater risk of tangling there is.
The rig offering the most movement would have the dropper tied on to the tippet via a double surgeons with the tag left long, 5"+. The dry would be tied onto that tag and the nymph out at the point. I have a hard time not creating tangles with this rig when fishing the dry/dropper rig, although I prefer it when fishing multiple wets. I find the knot tying the easiest with this rig compared to the others however.
The other two knotting options I know of involve the dropper section tied directly onto the dry. It can either be tied onto the bend of the hook or at the eye. Tying it onto the end of the hook can be quite frustrating, but I think this is the most tangle free set-up. (This is purely opinion, I have not done sufficient comparison testing to call it anything else.)
The best and probably most obvious way to prevent tangling with this rig is to false cast it as little as possible. Instead of fishing it straight upstream, I prefer to fish it up and across, and then use lots of mending to get a good drift to where I can make one false cast and get it back where I want it. If nothing else, give the Leisenring Lift a chance and then just cast back up from there.
[This message has been edited by BigCliff (edited 10 May 2005).]
Oh yeah, size. Really depends on the buyoancy of the dry. I’m sure you understand what I mean by that.
I would say that the nymph used is generally smaller than the dry, but this is a rule that can be bent. I wouldn’t hesitate to tie on a size 12 ESP behind a size 14 or even 16 Stimultor.
I would follow this rule however if the nymph had any weight. In fact, if it something like a sz16 copper john with a tungsten bead, I probably wouldn’t go smaller than a 12, and would even be looking for something with foam in it. I don’t mean to discourage this rigging, I have caught tons of fish with that nymph behind a size 10 chernobyl/hopper/etc. I just like to spend time fishing more than fussing with a dry to keep it afloat.
Dear Big Cliff:
Thanks for the awesome discourse on the dropper. It gave me just the idea I need to try and get my “feet wet”. As I experiment I may send you some questions.
Thanks for taking the time to explain in such detail,
Migs
Migs,
I am a graduate of the University of KISS, so let me give you my 2 cents on this subject. Fishing a dry with a dropper is by far may favorite way to fish. “Double your pleasure, double your fun” as I like to say.
I like to match my dry fly with something common on the river. In the summer on the Bighorn, I like to use a hopper, on the Green a Cicada, around Yellowstone a stonefly, caddis or Stimulator. All types of other attractors work well when the fish are looking up.
My nymph is chosen the same way, but about 80% of the time it is a midge pupa pattern (WD40, brassie, black quill, etc), but I do like to drop a pheasant tail, scud, baetis emerger, caddis nymph. At time, I will even add a littel micro shot just above the dropper.
Make sure your dry will support your dropper. You can tie your dropper into the eye of the dry, but I prefer just to tie it in at the bend. I always pinch my barbs and can’t remember ever losing a fish due to the line slipping off the hook.
The length of the dropper varies, but since I like to mostly fish the bank and riffles with this set up, I would say they would run between 18 and 24 inches.
I fish my dry as I would without a dropper using mends to make it float as natural as possible. I cast with a slightly open loop, but not too much.
I know you will enjoy this method a lot, as it has brought my clients and I a lot of good times over the years.
If you ever make it to Montana, I will give you a first hand lesson.
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Dear flyfishmt:
Thanks for the info and thanks for the invite to Montana! Actually my first invite ever in this realm.
I can’t wait to try your recipes for the bobber. Which fly has more success the dropper or the floater?
Migs
Migs,
It really depends on the day. Last year on the Bighorn, I caught two fish on hte dry and about 15 on the dropper. Down on the Green later on it was just the opposite. It’s just a fun way to fish.
One of my faves is a size 20 Griffin Gnat with a size 22 Black Quill dropper. This really works well when have a bunch of “Scum Suckers” working a back eddy.
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Another trick I use when casting multiple flies is to use a understated version of the Belgian/elliptical cast. Making the backcast somewhat sidearm and then a more vertical forward cast open up the loop in the rear and helps prevent tangles.
This will do a little harm to your accuracy, but likely make your vocabulary more civilized.
Thanks Big Cliff:
I definitely will try it next time out.
Migs
Anyone ever put a microshot on the dropper tippet to get it to penetrate the water a little better?
tie tie your dropper nypmh onto the bend of the dry fly with an improved clinch knot.
BigFlatBrook, I have tried that a few times, but you’ll need to be extra careful not to cause tangles when fishing that rig.
I might be more likely to add an extra dropper and put the small shot on that with a lighter tippet. That way the most dense item is out on the end and a little less likely to tangle. the point of the lighter tippet is that you can break that off should it get stuck on the bottom.
Larry Tullis did an article in Fly Fisherman recently on rigging this way, though without the dry. He refers to this method as “Bounce Nymphing”. Its basically the same idea as what the Bass crowd calls drop-shotting and works really well.
Another way to minimize tangling is to use a blood knot and tie your dropper to the tag end of the heavier section of leader, which is normally closer to the leader butt.