Anyone that ties flies commercially here is a question for you?
How much do you guys mark your flies up after material cost? Could anyone send me some price lists or examples. I might have a chance to start tying for some stores if I relocate. You can send me an email if you do not wish to share over the board. Thanks.
Seege
Typically shops tell you what they pay.
Hi Seege,
L William is right; in most situations the fly shop will tell you what they pay. Most fly shops expect a Keystone markup on their flies (if they plan on staying in business) which is 50%. In this situation a fly they sell for $2.00 they would pay $1.00 for it. Out of that $1.00 you would pay for your materials, overhead, income tax, state tax, and Federal Excise Tax as indicated by fishbum.
You question was more directed at what we charge. As Gretchen and I have gotten older (and more recognized in the fly fishing world) our fly prices have risen so we can maintain a balance between what we can/want to produce and the demand. I’m not listing all of our prices but for example one of our favorite flies to tie is the Humpy in it’s various configurations. We charge $48.00 per dozen and keep as busy as we want. The Muddle May is $75.00 per dozen; obviously we don’t have as many customers for this fly. We can tie about ten to twelve Humpies per hour and seven or eight Muddle Mays. Our per/hour income is about the same no matter which we are tying. By the way, Federal Excise Tax is based on the LOWEST price charged for flies not the actual. We have one customer we sell to who gets the flies at a much reduced rate which provides a lower base on which to pay the 10% tax for all the other flies we sell - totally legal by the way. We learned this way of reducing Federal Excise Tax from the IRS in a class they taught about ten years ago at an industry show.
I hope this information is helpful. Take care & …
Tight Lines - Al Beatty [url=http://www.btsflyfishing.com:96989]www.btsflyfishing.com[/url:96989]
Geez Al, now that was something I did not know (about the excise tax)! THANK-YOU!!!
$48/dozen…holy mackeral!!
Thanks Al and the rest who responded. I forgot about paying taxes and all of that other stuff. Lots of things to consider as I would not want to get rich doing it just something to keep me acitvely involved.
Seege
Fireman,
I do not do it to make a living. I also guide and I have a wife who is gainfully employed. I’d be hesistant to get to the point where I was forced to tie 8 hours daily, or more. It’s not in my personality to be that rigid.
Along with payment for the product usually comes some sort of retail discount so you can factor that in. Unless you tie on a huge scale (or gets Al’s cost per dozen 
) then taxes are really not that bad. The hardest part is finding someoen in the IRS who can help you get started! Figure that you’ll get paid somewhere between $10 and $15 per dozen depending on fly and shop, more if no other perks are offered.
But I love to tie flies and with each dozen my skills grow. It’s not for everyone, but there is a “neatness factor” when you realize that your flies may be catching fish anywhere in the world. It pays for toys and materials and is a heckuva lot of fun. Just keep it within your capabilities. Shops want bins full of flies that look the same and meet thier demands. I know how fast I can tie and how many hours a day I want to spend tying. The folks I tie for rarely crunch me so I can schedule everything pretty easy. I am VERY careful not to overextend myself. Repeated quality is the key.
KUDOS to all the shops who still use domestic tiers at double the rate or more of buying overseas.
I am shocked that someone would pay 48 bucks for a dozen flies.
<*(((((><
Jim in CO
Bostonangler -
They aren’t paying $48 for a dozen flies. They are paying $48 for a dozen flies tied by Al & Gretchen Beatty. That is the difference.
“Catch 'em all ~ Put 'em back!”
Visit [url=http://www.warmwaterangler.net:b8b48]Warmwater Angler[/url:b8b48]
No offense to anyone but I would not pay that if Jesus himself tied those humpies.
<*(((((><
Jim in CO
Al’s flies are worth it. I bought a few (not a dozen) just to check them out and they are so very well made, colorful and perfect.
Al, You could charge even more 
Al has touched on something here, and it’s called building a clientelle. If you want to sell to fly shops, and compete with foreign labor at $1.00 a day, be my guest. Al and Gretchen can get $48 a dozen for a difficult fly because 1. the flies are worth it and 2. they have built a clientelle, a following of people who realize that they are getting something that is special, and are willing to pay for it. That doesn’t happen overnight, but it can happen if you are dilligent, promote yourself well, and have another source of income.
Eric
Eric,
Great post , that sums it up in a nut shell. Don’t quit the day job, unless it’s time to retire.
Take Care, Jim
Hey Folks,
You say…" because you are getting something special"…so you’re willing to pay more…maybe that applies to display flies but…how many times have we seen in this BB that…“the fish don’t care”…if I’m reading this right…Al’s getting $4 a fly…[well not every fly]… and there’s markup on that…if I went into a fly shop and saw $8 on Humpies I don’t think I’d go there again…I really think I must be missing something here…
[This message has been edited by ducksterman (edited 08 June 2005).]
Ducksterman,
Some people just like to have the best or most expensive thing. A 2000.00 bambo rod, a 500.00 reel and a $4.00 fly on the end of their $10.00 leader. If they can afford it ,let’em go for it. One thing for sure , it’s over my budget.
Al and Gretchen tie some beautiful flies. I have one of their Humpies in my fly collection. Outstanding work. Seeing how the average hourly shop rate for a plumber , electrician or a mechanic is $50.00 and up, the $40.00 or so an hour for a top level flytyer is not that unreasonable.
Hey a Hugo will get you to work but a Escalade will get you there in style.
Take care, Jim
[This message has been edited by Jim Slattery (edited 08 June 2005).]
On a lighter side, I emailed a friend recently to ask how his first winter of commercial tying went. He did okay as he had a shop lined up with enough orders before he started but I still got a chuckle out of his sarcastic response: “It was great. A good way to get fat, have the ability to work in your underwear and drink beer at the same time and stay broke…”
W
I’ve gotten some of Fireman’s flies in various swaps and they are certainly professional quality. Good luck, Seege, wherever this takes you.
Rangerman thanks for the compliments very much appreciated. Along with your flies I have seen some really great contributions to my swaps this year. Just to let you know I put some of your flies out on the water over Memorial Day and the browns loved them.
The shop that Im referring to sells the local patterns tied by local guys so I think I would fit the bill. He also sells the overseas flies of all the basic flybox staples which is fine with me. I wouldnt want to tie those constantly that wouldnt be my interest at all. I feel this might be an opportunity for me to maybe get some of my patterns out there along with tying some of the local stuff.
Thanks for all your replies so far.
Seege
Here is a part two question.
What materials do you guys use meaning the top quality, midrange or low end? As of right now I am a bargain shopper and Im sure there is a difference. I dont think of top quality material when Im filling my own fly boxes as long as the pattern represents what I am duplicating. I think If I was to tie commercially I would use only the best that is just me. Any other thoughts?
Seege
Seege,
I use the best materials available, in the long run it’s cheaper and you can sell your flies with confidence.
Hooks are a tricky proposition. Some shops demand Tiemco hooks, generally I make them supply them. Some shops , especially on the east coast will except regular Mustads. I’ve found that Daiichi Is a good Product at a great price and is the preferred hook for most standard patterns. Good Chemically sharpened hooks and consistant quality that don’t break the bank.
Good luck with your venture, remember Quality sells, the speed will come and don’t quit your day job 
Take care, jim
[url=http://www.Jimsflyco.com:1a8b2]www.Jimsflyco.com[/url:1a8b2]
and stay broke
I’m reminded of the farmer who won the lotto. When asked about his plans, he replied, “I guess I’ll just keep farming 'til the money runs out.”