Here is a quote from the website of the review Dave just gave you…“[i][FONT=Arial]This Article Was First published in July, 2007.”
[/i][/FONT]
Scott, thanks for correcting that error. I’ll go back and edit my post.
Regards,
Ed
Good point Allan.
I see vises priced from $20 to $500. I would like to spend around $100 or a little less if I can get away with it.
Is $100 for tools and materials reasonable?
I will be fishing for, well, everything. Where I live it’s mostly bass and panfish with some stocked trout streams so I’m thinking that I’ll have to drive 30-50 miles to get to a more pristine trout habitat.
Question - Do you only tie flies that you will fish with? Or are some just for the pleasure of the craft?
rpb
I think the Griffin Montana Pro is one of the best beginner vises around because it has the same jaw that the Mongoose has. It’s about $75, and that leaves you $25 for a bobbin and scissors.
For flytying, need and want don’t necessarily mean the same thing. Unless you’re Lee Wulff, who tied flies without vise or bobbin ( http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TwK0gYTzRz4 - go to 16:45), a vise, bobbin and scissors are what you’ll “need”. Look at some of the vise recommendations and figure that’ll be the biggest initial purchase (still think the Thompson A is a good way to go).
Scissors? I modified a pair of inexpensive thread nips by adding a darning needle to use as a bodkin/general poking thing; total cost was about $6
Bobbin - the ceramic tipped ones are nice, but I’ve been using basic S & Ms for over 20 years and have only had one develope a groove (which I fixed with 30 seconds of my time and some 400 grit wet/dry sandpaper). Unfortunately, they’re not easy to come by any more; the “upgraded” (read, more expensive for what looks like cosmetic reasons only) Wasatch version kinda defeats the point.
Cement - Sally Hansen’s Hard As Nails
Other tools are again, nice to have but not necessary:
Whip finisher - learn to tie by hand
Half-hitch tool - use an old retractable ball-point pen
Hair stacker - an old brass shell casing works (although you may want one if you’re going to be tying wth ungulate hair)
dubbing teaser - glue a piece of Velcro (with the hooked ends) to a popsicle stick
Buy a couple boxes of hooks, a spool of black and brown thread, start with easy flies that don’t have a lot of moving parts, get comfortable, and then start buying everything under the sun.
Regards,
Scott
Similar to ScottP’s scissors, I’ve been using Mundial’s “Thread Clippers” for about 5 years. I bought mine at AC Moore. the beauty of this scissor is that replaceable blades are available.
Here’s a vintage Thompson model A for $20
http://www.regalvise.com/inex.htmlI invested in a Regal INEX C-lamp vise in 1990. About 10 years later I added a pedestal base. And 23 yrs later upgraded…to a new Regal with stainless jaws. Personally, the INEX is the best basic vise on the market.
rbp,
If you look at the links which I included in my first post you should be able to get the tools for $100. You might be able to find them cheaper, elsewhere. Let me warn you against the “travel kits” that stick a small vice into a corner of the box etc… I tried that. It was a real pain and greasy in a way unlike any other vice I’ve ever seen.
regards,
Ed
I also went to a Thompson right after my introduction to the craft with a Herter’s knock-off.
I still have 2 virtually new Thompsons BUT would warn folks that today’s imported Thompsons are not as good.
I bought some replacement parts for older units that I had used for classes. The quality is not there anymore.
It’s only my opinion, but I would suggest beginners start with something cheap to see if they are serious and then progress from there to any of our present quality models. As beginners, most are not qualified to evaluate the finer aspects of a good vise since those details are mostly things of personal preference. They should talk to another tier and not a salesman.
The Peak or the Danvise. If you joined us on Skype Sunday nite at 8pm Maine time…my friend can show you and talk about the Peak. He loves it. He has been tying all his life and it is his choice. It is very sleak. I prefer the Danvise. This is something that is just unique to the individual and what that perosn likes the feel of. I can show you my Danvise Sunday nite and talk about it iffen you wish. I have modified it a lot. I would not want the vise without the extension. With the extension it is my favorite. I put a 4" turning wheel on it. Put the extension on upside down and had friend drill and tap the jaws to a spot where it will center the shaft of the hook with the extension upside down. I put on earth magnets to hold material. Glue the shaft of a pencil with the eraser tip onto a washer to hold material down on the earth magnet. Added some pony tail rubber bands to hold material. 'Tis my favorite. Believe it or not I have plans in my head to motorize this vise. Could have a motor just sitting in the background with a noodle of a rubber band. Just slip it over the 4" wheel when want motor speed. Some flies…like an ant done totally with thread take a ton of turns. And I have some hooks that are about 3" long. Putting a body on one and back to the eye is also a ton of wraps. A new person would have no need for a motor at all. Most lifetime tiers would not use one either. Just me. But Danvise or Peak is my recommendation. I don’t think you can fault with either one if you owned one. I would definitely start out with a true rotary vise…and not just a stationary vise. The first Montana Nymph I ever tied looked great on top. But the bottom looked terrible…the part the fish sees! With a rotary you can easily turn the fly at will and check out the bottom…or even do some tying with the hook upside down. Whether to tie only with what you fish with…or for pleasure would be up to the individual. No one could predict if YOU would tie unused flies for pleasure. Maybe…maybe not…
good luck…sorry for length of post
Jim
Hi,
Sorry, but I must honestly say that the answer, IMHO, to your $100 question is NO! At least not if you want anything with any quality to it. Aside from the vise plus tools, if you’re going to tie some dry flies, just a couple of packs of decent but inexpensive hooks and hackle will be at least $30+ or so. You want another type of fly for trout, panfish, bass and crappie, let’s look at a simple and very popular fly and the materials which I’m estimating for the ‘Wooly Bugger’.
Pack of hooks - $4.75
Thread - $1.75
Pack of strung maribou - $4.75
Pack of chenille - $1.75
Pack of strung saddle hackle - $3.75
Total = $16.75
Now you can use a couple of those materials for other flies too but others will require other materials too and be costly until you build up some varying inventory where materials overlap a lot. So NO, the $100 won’t get you too far.
Your second question is something only you can answer. Maybe you’ll tie a fly and not like it. Take a razor to it at once and start over. If you don’t like a fly, you’ll never use it and it’s just taking up space and the hook is being wasted. But my suggestion would be to learn with flies that you’ll use. When you do catch some fish, regardless the species, it will prompt you to do more and you may get to enjoy the art and activity of tying as well as the result of releasing a fish caught on your own creation. Most of all have fun.
Allan
Allan,
You’re right, I was thinking $100 for tools.
One can always start with one of these kits: http://www.basspro.com/White-River-Fly-Shop-Fly-Tying-Kit-Trout-Tying/product/27765/?cmCat=CROSSSELL_PRODUCT
It might be enough for a beginner to decide whether or not to get more involved. When I got back into fly fishing about a decade ago, I got one of these kits and found it acceptable.
Regards,
Ed
P.S. Here is a cheaper kit. I’m not familiar with it. http://www.basspro.com/White-River-Fly-Shop-Vise-Tools-and-Material-Kit/product/1302120946/?cmCat=CROSSSELL_PRODUCT
rpb,
I have followed this thread for several days and I feel you are probably no closer to a choice than you were when you first asked due to the many different suggestions that have been made and they all are very good suggestions and recommendations, so, I decided to “throw out” my suggestion to really confuse you. You were concerned with how much money you need to spend up front and that is a very good question and needs to be addressed. First thing to keep in mind is that there is a chance you may decide that you do not enjoy tying flies and when/if that happens, you do not want to have money tied up in expensive tools and vise that you will never get back. Start out like I and most other fly tyers did on a smaller “learning” curve. You do need to purchase a vise and tools that are of reasonable quality. You do not have to start out with a true rotary vise which is going to set you back $100 and more. You will never get that money back when you decide to not tie and sell your tools and vise. I would recommend a rotary vise but not a true rotary vise to start with. I started with a “fixed” head vise and then purchased a rotary vise and now tie on a true rotary vise. Starting this way taught me to appreciate what each style of vise can do for my tying. So, I suggest you start out on a smaller scale with the vise and as you progress with fly tying and decide to upgrade, that is when you will know, from your tying experience, what you want your upgraded vise to do for you. This gets worst, trust me, because I own 5 vises now and they are all different in what they offer. After 20 plus years of tying, I have finally settled on the vise I enjoy using the most and at times will dig out one of the other vises and tie on it just for fun. I suggest starting out with a C-clamp vise for starter due to you being able to adjust the vise head height so you will be comfortable. My true rotary vise I tie on now is a tabletop pedestal model but I use it in a C-clamp so that it is at a height that is comfortable for me.
Here is what I recommend that you do: Go to Hookhack.com and give some consideration to their H&H Signature Stainless Steel Tool Kit w/storage pouch. This will get you the beginning hand tools you will need and the quality is good. This tool kit is on sale now for $44.95.
Then look at their Super II Rotary Vise which is also pretty good quality and is on sale now for $17.06.
Your total investment for decent hand tools and a vise to start out with will be around $62.00. Once you have the tools and the vise, come back here on FAOL and we can discuss tying material or you can PM me if you wish. Don’t get in a hurry with your purchases. Take one step at a time and ask questions. Fly tying is a very relaxing hobby, at least it is for me, and knowing that you can create your own patterns that catch fish is a blessing and will give you much satisfaction. When you ask others questions, remember that they have been tying for many years and they now know what they like and dislike. They have forgotten how much they have learned by starting out on a smaller scale and learning from their tying experiences. If you start out at the top with your tools and vise, you have only one direction to go and that is down to find what you really enjoy using for you. Start out at the bottom and upgrade from there to find what works for you and you will have spent less money when you reach your comfort level with tools and a vise.
The above are only my suggestions based on my fly tying experiences over the years.
Just wanted to thank everyone for the input.
I ended up with, per a friends recommendation, a Regal.
He has also steered me to some good tools and some other folks that are very experienced tiers.
Couldn’t be happier.
Thanks again
rpb
RPB, You won’t be sorry with your choice. Have fun!
Ralph
Good for you and good choice. Just as an aside, you obviously exceeded the $100 threshold that our responses were typically based on, so how much did you spend for the vise plus tools? Just curious.
Allan
Regal makes good vises and that one should last you a long, long time. As per Allan’s post above, you did probably break the $100 mark unless you bought one used. Congrats and I hope you enjoy tying.
Sorry to change the subject slightly, but FONT - do you still tie and fish those great looking wet flies? How much $ do you think it costs to tie the fly whose name you moniker?
Hi Allan:
Yes I still tye and fish them. I really am a classic winged wet fly tyer and fisherman. It really does not cost a lot of money to tye them flies at all. Think about it this way:
- Hook
- Floss or Dubbing or Wool yarn
- Mylar tinsel
- Hen Cape for Full Collar Hackle Yeah can cost me about $20 but I get o ton of flies out of one cape.
- Paired Duck quills.
I find the materials easy to get and pretty inexpensive to obtain. The thing with winged wet flies is they just take more time to tie and you have to know a few little tricks.