OK, I lied. Another post with a question.

[DazWah]

i dont think the trout will decide to take a fly based on how long the tails are, the point of the tail length is to make the fly sit properly on the water.

[Steven]

Not really sure if it's fair to compare spinner tail length to that used on Catskills. Catskills are duns, not spinners. Spinners have tails longer than the dun, so by definition they won't match.

I think Catskill proportions came about because: A) they would float the fly; B) cock correctly upon landing most of the time; C) they just look right. Certain things just look right and are inherently pleasing...Marilyn Monroe, Italian shotguns, certain cars, Catskills. Deep down inside, the lines of a Catskill appeal to us.

FWIW, AK Best has probably been the most outspoken critic of Catskill proportions. He's noted, numerous times, that both tails and wings on Catskills are generally shorter than the naturals they represent.

[ScottP]

For duns I use shank length as a measure for tails; for spinners I use shank length+ (no specific distance, just a little bit extra):





This applies mostly to the Rusty Spinners I tie for the Epeorus and PMD spinner falls I may come across out west and also Hendricksons & Quill Gordons here in the east. If I were to fish the western Green Drake spinner, with those shorter tails, I guess I'd have to adjust.

Regards,
Scott

[JohnScott]

Regarding the pic of the drake from Westfly, that is most likely a freshly hatched dun, thus the short tails and darker overall body and wing colors. The natural drake duns I've seen in a number of places have noticeably longer tails, and the spinners have even longer tails than the mature duns.

Regarding Sandy's comments on priorities, if I can call them that, of size and color, I wonder if they are more relevant to spring creek situations than to other angling situations. Most of what I've read on priorities, and my own experience, which includes very little sping creek fishing, suggests that the order of priorities is size, silhouette, action, and color. Action includes movement inherent in the construction of the fly and presentation techniques.

If I were going to fish a spring creek, I certainly would defer to Sandy's recommendations.

John

P.S. Chewydog's pic of the PMD is one of the best I've seen, dirty windshield or not.

[narcodog]

Another aspect about Catskill style flies is that they are tied for ruff roiling water. That's why they have big bushy hackle, slim bodies and the bushy tails. The trout have just milliseconds, for the most part, the decide to eat the bug. Then again I have used Catskill styled flies on every type of water and had success.

[pittendrigh]

Regarding Sandy's comments on priorities, if I can call them that, of size and color, I wonder if they are more relevant to spring creek

Yes. Absolutely. Nothing I said about "change pattern" and "matching size and color but not profile" has any bearing outside the spring creek or tailwater context. On freestone mountain streams you don't get picky refusals during carpet-thick hatches. I jumped in the way I did because Byron's nifty-looking dry flies are mostly no-hackle spring creek and tailwater like patterns. So it seemed appropriate in that context.