"Right" proportions in flies

[thorarinna]

Hi group.

When I tye flies I have the proportions after my taste. I have the length of the tail, the length that seems to be right e.t.c.
Many years ago I read some artickles about "right" proportions in flies, but I have forgotten all about it.

I can see that some of the rules are fine but I can't understand others, f.ex. that the tail of a dry fly should be one or one and a half times the length of the body, I can imagine it's right for a mayfly but what about a midge?

You should wrap the ribs 5 times on a wet fly, why???

There are many rules for the length of the hacle/beard, but some nymphs have very long legs or at least something "hanging" after their entire body.

How did those rules come about in the first place?
If you follow them are your flies then of the right silhouette?
Do you guys use this as a guideline or do you just go your own way?

Regards,
Thorarinn

[kbproctor]

If I am tying to throw at fish and feed to trees, bushes, rocks, snags, and other fly devouring stuff, I go my own way. If I am tying for a swap or another fisherman, I go by the "rules".

[Normand]

How did those rules come about in the first place?

probably from studying the actual insects

some reading

http://www.sexyloops.com/flytying/proportion.shtml

http://www.ozarkflyfishers.org/fly/dryfly.html

http://www.stvrainangler.com/FlyTyin...roportions.htm

http://flytyingworld.com/article-detail-6-DryFlies.html

[Buddy Sanders]

I just want the flies to look right to me.

If you look at archives of the really good fly tyers out there, you can see very little in the way of standardization, both within patterns and across patterns. Everyone seems to have their own way of doing things the right way.

Besides, since very few of the flies we tie look like anything that's really alive, I think the correct proportions on then are pretty subjective.

The only proper judge of the fly is the fish.

Buddy

[Steven]

Real midges don't have tails, hence make the tails as long as you like.

FWIW, some of the proportions for mayfly dries are for balancing the fly and help it "cock" properly when it lands.

[chewydog]

Real midges don't have tails, hence make the tails as long as you like.

True, but they do have a shuck.
My complaint about a lot of mayfly nymphs I see are the thorax is too short, and the tail too long.

[Denny]

I always ask the fish to judge if my tie to see if it is correct.

I feel old patterns are good but for my fishing?? I normally do my own thing.

Denny

[narcodog]

Dry flies were started in this country in the Catskills by T. Gordon,Rube Cross, the Darby's and Dette"s. That's where the standards come from. As was said if you are in a contest or swap that is how the drys are judged. If you are tying wets then the standard is Bergman. Hewitt and Flick came along and put some twist on the Gordon flies. If you are so inclined start reading the history of FF in the US. It is very interesting and as addictive as tying or fishing as anything.
Then when you start looking at S/H's you need to Brooks and Lee, Roger Fogg and others. There as many ways to properly tie a S/H as there any. As each river, country and area has a different styles. such as a Tummel fly or a Clyde style.
Then you come to flymphs which were originated by J. Leisering and P. Hidy. Of the Pocono region of Pa.

[NJTroutbum]

In many instances, the proportions are to ensure that the fly rides properly on the water...or in the case of a nymph incorrect proportions can cause a pattern to ride upsdie down. But agreed, there is no standard aside from a patterns history that must be adhered to. If your trying to tie a particular pattern accurately, I would suggest researching it and tying it correctly. But the fish don't care.

For instance.....I no longer tie an elk hair caddis with a rib. Why add extra weight? I palmer my hackle butt-to-head. And I see zero durability or ride issues. But if I was tying as an entrance fly....I would tie it historically correct.

[redietz]

Some of the "rules" (or standards) make sense, but of course you're free to disregard them.

The five wraps of rib may seem arbitrary at first, but it's easier to get even spacing with an odd number of than an even -- you make sure the middle rib is in the middle of the body. Once you've realized that, and notice that three doesn't look like enough and seven really crowds the body, 5 is a good number, if you're tying for sale and want your flies to look consistent.

Until comparatively recently, most dry flies were tied to imitate mayflies, so the one or one and a half is not only somewhat in proportion to the real insect, but it fit in with the belief that the fly should rest on the hackles, the point of the tail, and that the point of the hook should just rest on the surface. This was what Halford determined to be the best way to keep the fly floating as long as possible. We have different ideas today, and indeed, proportions have changed to follow.

The main driving force behind having standard proportions is to allow the commercial tyer to have all flies of the same pattern that he tied look the same. The only way to achieve this is to have a rule. If the rules resulted in flies that didn't catch fish, they would have changed over time.

On traditional patterns, I see no reason to not use the traditional proportions. On patterns that I'm making up to represent a specific insect, I'll adjust to fit the need -- but I'll still end up with a rule of some sort.