overlining

[white43]

After I finished my 8 wt. I anxiously bought an 8 line and was set. So I'd hoped. When I showed the rod to a fellow at a fly shop for his apprasial of the rod, he used several lines on it and determined the best performance was a 10 line. Had I waited I would have bought a 10- wt. line from him, but I guess I was a bit greedy. Last week I found a discounted 10 forward weight line and am putting it onto the reel. I don't have any problems doing so. However, my 6 wt. rod has floating, forward weight line in dire need of replacement. My easy answer was to simply install the 8 wt. line on the 6 wt. rod. What are the expected minuses or problems I can expect from doing so? This is a St. Croix Pro Grafite that should be rated fairly close to its intentions, where as the blank was advertised as an 8, which the shop admitted might be conservative. I'll await your answers. JGW

[BigFlatBrook]

I've been curious about the overlining/underlining thing in the past. Here's my two cents.

First, you probably know that here are standards for determining the weight of a line. It's determined by how much the first 30 feet or so of the line weighs. The Cortland line website has some good information on this and has a table describing how much a 3-weight line is suppposed to weigh, how much a 4-weight line weighs and so.

The way I've come to think about the overlining thing is that rods are designed to cast "best" with a certain amount of weight in the "air". If you put a 7-weight line on a 6-weight rod, you reach that point with less line in the air, so-to-speak. If you put an 8-weight line on a 6 weight rod, you reach that point with even less line.

The conclusion is that when overlined, a rod loads better on short casts, and breaks-down a bit on longer casts. The converse could also be true, a rod might perform better when casting at distance when it is underlined.

All that being said, the weight designation is up to the manufacturer -- so the answer partly depends on the rod and how the manufacter decides what weight line is best. In this case, I guess that would be the maker of the blank.

I decided not to fool around with overlining and underlining rods myself -- partly because I think the manufacturer weight designation is probably the right choice under most common fishing conditions.

After all that, I guess I should have just said you gotta try it and see. I doubt it will hurt the rod.

[This message has been edited by BigFlatBrook (edited 17 April 2005).]

[lee s]

Like BFB said, it won't hurt the rod. Heck, you're running around with the rod trying to hook and play the largest danded fish in the water anyway. Whats a few grains of weight more in a line?
Like JC commenting on face-wind helping someone realize the load on the backcast better, I think, maybe to a certain extent, over-lineing can do the same.....make it easier to feel the rod load.
When useing shooting heads it is almost necessary to up-line. Though now some manufacturers are "down marking" to really confuse those of us with very limited mental function.

[beadleech]

I have one rod that I "underline" on a regular basis because it simply casts a lighter line better when you are casting a long line. That's how I ususally use this rod. On another [a St Croix LU] I found that I don't really like "fast" rods after I bought it. I know - cast B4 buying! And I did but casting for a short time on the grass is completely different from fishing the rod for a day or so. I can't feel the thing load and I have to "work" more with this rod than my older rods. So I overlined it. It slowed the action down 'til I can finally feel it when I cast. Don't have to pay so much attention to my casting. I like easy.

I think the "mfgr's line weight" is a suggested weight and may very well be different for different casters. The only to find out is to try it.

Just my $.09 worth [inflation, you know]

Donald

[sharps]

I have a St. Croix, Imperial that is rated as a 5 Wt. and it simply didn't feel "alive" with a 5 wt. line. I put my reel with a 6 wt. line on that rod and did it ever come to life. I asked a similar question to yours on another board and received responses similar to what you have received. General consensus seems to be try a heavier or lighter line. The rod will tell you what it likes. Ain't gonna hurt nuthin'.

Vic

[anglerdave]

John

While I'm not a big fan of over lining, I think there is something to be said about finding a line that matches the rod. I have a St Croix 8' 5wt PG. I've tried different weight lines and my preference is still a 5wt line. About all you can do is try the 8wt and see how you like it. I suspect it will load your rod more and you will loose some distance when casting.

for the most part I trust the munufacturers specs and I've had few problems.I have an 8 wght pro graphite and I really battled to feel it loading until I either aerialised ALOT of line or lined up to a 10,so I guess it's really a matter of personal preference.

[BigCliff]

I generally agree with JC on this topic but will offer a varied point of view here. If the 8wt you built has less weight on it, (lighter, fewer, or single footed guides, less thread, less epoxy, stiffer ferrules) then you may need to bump up one line weight to get it to flex well.

However, you also keep in mind that a heavier line does not inherently fly better into the wind, a tighter loop does. To understand why, think of a golf ball versus a tennis ball. The golf ball weighs roughly 1.6 oz and the tennis ball weighs roughly 2 oz. If you teed them both up and whacked them with a Big Bertha, which would you expect to go farther? The golf ball will, due to its reduced wind resistance even though it weighs less. Casting loops work the same way.

With equal size loops, the 8wt line will be more effective at beating the wind than the 6wt, but overlining a rod generally results in bigger loops, not smaller ones. The greater weight puts more flex in the rod, which generally increases the distance between the top and bottom of the loop.

An 8 wt line will turn over a big/heavy fly better, but that's another matter all together.

I have cast those pro graphite rods and don't think they should be double-overlined.

[Rich Ward]

Hi there White The one thing that has not been brought up that you may need to consider.... You may be doing some damage to the rod. No one is sure how many time you can bend a fly rod before you Fatuge the blank. But experts do agree that every time you bend it some life is gone and the more stress you put on it each bend the more life that go's By over lineing a rod X 2 you may be slowly breaking your rod. There is a fair amount of testing that goes into a rod line match and with very few exceptions the rod companys are right and the shops are wrong!!

Food for thought

Rich

[BigFlatBrook]

The lifetime of graphite is very long, unless it's abused. Heat, such as storing in the trunk of your car in the summer, can cause it to break down. Chips can weaken the wall. But it ought to perform for many, many years otherwise. Personally, I doubt the fibers degrade much, if at all, during casting, even if overlined.

If it were a bamboo rod, I would think differently about it.