Nail knot vs UniKnot

[Spud]

Steven,

Looking at the diagram can be deceiving. When tying a double-surgeon's knot you need to pull the standing line through the "overhand" type knot that you create. The knot in my diagram doesn't involve that. I don't see how one could tie fly line to leader using a double-surgeons. The uni-knot splice looks just like a nail knot when tied, and is tightened to the point on the fly line that it doesn't slip off. The "uni" name comes from wrapping one of the tags around another standing part of the knot.

Actually, with a little practice, that uni-knot splice is a very easy knot to tie even on the stream. I have not tied a nail knot since my first days of flyfishing!

You are right about the double-uni-knot though. I normally use the blood knot to attach pieces of leader or leader to tippet, but the double-uni could be a very strong connection.

[This message has been edited by Spud (edited 10 March 2006).]

[ducksterman]

"I don't see how one could tie fly line to leader using a double-surgeons."

You could but you would have to pull the whole leader through....twice.

[Spud]

Well of course it can be done.

I have never used it for that purpose though. I'm wondering if it would leave a big knot? How about a kink between the fly line and leader?

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[This message has been edited by Spud (edited 10 March 2006).]

[ducksterman]

I haven't either...I think very inappropriate like you are alluding.

[BigFlatBrook]

Hmmm -- that looks like an interesting and easy way to tie a nail knot to me!

[Spud]

Here's some more directions for tying it, this went along with the illustration:

1) If you are right-handed, place the fly line with it's tip facing to your left, directly over and parallel to the butt of the leader. Allow a full 6 inches of fly line tip and leader butt to overlap to make sure you have enough material to finish the knot.

2) While clasping the fly line and leader butt between the thumb and forefinger, make an overhand loop (fig b). Clasp the loop between thumb and forefinger of the left hand, being certain they are at the precise spot where the materials forming the loop intersect.

3) Clasp the leader butt tab at your right between the thumb and forefinger of your right hand and pass it through the loop from back to front as few as four or as many as 8 times (fig c).

4) After winding the leader butt tab around the loop, continue to clasp as before, between your riht thumb and forefinger, reach down with the middle finger, ring finger, or pinky of your right hand and catch hold of the standing length of fly line, which should be found directly beneath the leader butt tab. At the same time, while continuing to grip the loop with the tumb and forefinger of your left hand, squeeze the middle finger, ring finger, and pinky of your left hand around the fly line tip and standing length of the leader butt, both of which will be conveniently nearby if you're tying the knot correctly.

5) Release your grip on the loop and pull simultaneaously on the leader butt tab and the standing length of the fly line to the riht, and the fly line tip tab and the standing lenth of the leader butt to the left (fig c). This will straighten the line and leader, removing the loop, and will tighten the knot sufficiently for you do do the fine work that comes next.

6) Wet the knot. Alternately tug gently, first on the standing length of leader butt with your left hand, while firmly clasping both the standing length of the fly line and leader butt tab in your right hand, then the leader butt tab with your right hand while holding the fly line tip tab and the standing length of leader butt with your left hand. Repeat this step as many times as necessary. (sometimes the monofilament coiled around the fly line will require a bit of additional persuasion which can be accomplished by adjusting them with eather one or both of your thumbnails).

7) When the knot seems secure, one last powerful tug should be exerted on the standing length of the leader butt to the left and the standing length of fly line to the right, this tug will ensure that the knot digs into the fly line coating sufficiently to prevent slippage.

Finally, the leader butt tab and fly line tip tab should be clipped flush to the knot.

I don't know who invented the knot, but I give credit to Art Lee for publishing it.

It's not easy to describe, but after doing it a few times it seems easy to do...lots of words for a simple knot...


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As mentioned, they arent the same, but I use the uni-knot with sucess.

By the way there is no such thing as a knot that cant be tied with only one end

[ducksterman]

I wonder if articles discussing knots don't sometimes lead us astray.
E.G. here is a link to a series of knots [which you may find interesting...a lot of "different" knots presented]...that describes a uniknot which isn't what I think the uniknot is..maybe they are correct...what do you think?

[url=http://www.fishingcairns.com.au/page6-1.html:e9fe2]http://www.fishingcairns.com.au/page6-1.html[/url:e9fe2]

[ducksterman]

Fly Goddess ,what happened?

[ducksterman]

OK...I did what Buzz above suggested ...didn't earlier since I had been there numerous times before...but it turns out I hadn't picked up on the description of the uniknot.

Accepting that that is THE uniknot then I was wrong and they are not the same.

Having said that I will say I have seen experts using the Fast Tie tools tying a knot and calling it a uniknot////e.g. Tom White casting video where he is touting the use of the "Tie Fast Combo Tool".

I have been using these types of tools for years ...and now realize I was [am] tying a nail knot only easier than using a nail...live and learn...

BTW...a double [what I'll now call "nail knot"] works quite well for splicing backing..going mono butt to leader butt..leader to leader....leader to tippet...or anytime your making major diameter changes....very smooth...it even works for a slipping loop.