Newbee with a Question
I will be vacationing in FL next month and am curious about the hook sizes and fly lengths for streamer, clouser minnow, and deceiver type patterns. I am currently tying some flies in anticipation on sizes #6 2X long and #2 3X long (the sizes I already have) and I am using white/white, red/white, yellow/white, and chartruese/white coloration patterns. Any information would be helpful. Thanks in Advance- Jay
It all depends on what you're fishing for.. the size 2 would be good for bonefish (bonefish flies often run a little larger in Fla than in other destinations) and other flats type fish. You might want to add some larger deceiver type flies, size 1/0 or 2/0 for snook, jacks, specs and small tarpon.
If you're looking for an all around assortment of flies you might want to add some size 2 tan clousers, some crab patterns (Merkin in tan/brown size 2 or 1), some Borski shrimpy stuff or Kwans size 2 in olives and browns, 1/0 deceivers as a general baitfish imitation, something with a spun deer hair head (like a Tabory Snake fly) for waking across the surface in the mangroves, some weedless stuff like bendbacks size 1, and a few 2/0 popper of crease flies, and some big 3/0 heavily weighted flies like half and halfs for dredging holes and channels.
This would pretty much cover you for anything- bones, reds, specs, snook, jacks, tarpon, snappers, ladyfish etc.
Just my .0000002.
mark
peregrines:
Thanks for the recommendations. I am not going to be "species specific" with these patterns and I will be using a 7WFT line. Is there a hook shank length to tail length proportion I should worry about (like trout flies)? Jay
Not really, I don't think you have to be too fanatic about proportions. The main thing is getting it in front of something.
So to imitate a variety of bait species and sizes and just to give you a ballpark idea of proportions for your small clousers 2" overall length for size 6 and around 3" for size 2 sounds about right. A size 2 Mustad 34007 or 3407 is about 1", so a wing about 3X shank length is a good rule of thumb for clousers and stuff like bendbacks, and other stuff like deceiver collars tied in the front of the shank.
For a deciever, I like a tail about 3-4x shank length, so that the collar reaches about the first 1/2 or 2/3 of the tail. This gives a nice baitfish profile in the water. BTW, you can make "bucktail deceivers" by just substituting a sprig of bucktail for the saddle hackle on the tail.
The main thing is to keep all your flies sparse-- It really doesn't take much material, you should be able to see through the bucktail on your flies when dry. They'll be easier to cast, get to depth quicker, and the sparse material will move around a lot more for better action in the water.
So you'd have something like
clousers size 6 about 2", size 2 about 3" for overall goodness on flats and blind prospecting. Most anything will hit them including bonefish.
bendbacks about 3 1/2-4" for weedy waters. There's not much to them, just chenille or whatever body, and a bucktail wing with a topping of herl. White, blue over white, olive over white etc.
deceivers 1/0-2/0 about 5-6" overall length- a great all around fly that imitates a lot of different baitfish. Good for fishing the top 10 feet of water column with a floater for a range of species- specs, spanish mackeral, snook, tarpon, ladyfish, snappers etc
Snake flies- basically a deceiver with a spun deer hair head like a muddler. This is a great mullet imitation and is a lot of fun to fish in the 'black water" in canals and around mangroves. V wake it across the surface, it's a blast to have fish crash them. Tie them about 5-6" overall length.
Crab type fly about the size of a quarter for a size 2 hook. Great bonefish pattern as well as permit. If you are targeting bones on flats, it would be a good idea to carry some.
Kwan or borski type shrimp/crittery looking things in browns tans and olives about 2 1/2 to 3" long overall if you're specifically going to target bones. They'll also take red fish, snappers and other stuff.
A heavily weighted half and half or rabbit strip thing about 6" long on a 3/0 for chucking into deep water, around bridge abuttments from shore, or fishing holes, channels or over wrecks from a boat. Great for deep tarpon, grouper, snappers, etc.
Crease fly or poppers about 4-5" long overall on a size 2/0. These will take ladyfish, spanish mackeral, and all kinds of stuff and is fun when fish are on top. Jacks will whack anything if they're around, but they're a blast on topwater stuff. The action also can pull fish from a ways off too so it's a good pattern to try in deepish water 3+ feet deep if you're fishing blind.
These flies will cover you for a lot of different situations in saltwater, pretty much anywhere, but if you want to whittle it down, 3" clousers and a few 5" deceivers will cover a lot of bases.
Hope this helps. Good luck!
mark
Definatley take some blue/white clousers. We had the best luck on them for all species last year when I was down there. And I would also put some sort of crystal flash in there too. It adds so much more to the fly and the fish seemed to just hammer them compared to the few we tried without any flash.
We caught a few fish on other flies, but the clousers were by far the best producers. And take more than you think you'll need too. The fish are pretty toothy, and even those that aren't can shred a fly to bits, just catch one or two ladyfish and you'll understand.
Good luck,
TT
Mark and TT:
Thanks
, and I did buy and am using some of that "Flashabou" material in several colors. I will be taking my flytying stuff when we go to FL. Jay
Well, you should have a ton of fun then. See if you can find out about any underwater structure along the beach. Rocks especially will hold baitfish, and in turn you'll get gamefish coming along. You can also walk the beach looking for baitfish busting the surface and then cast into the maylay.
And, I would suggest taking a stripping basket with you. It will save you more frustration than you even know, especially if there's any surf. If the water is calm then it's not really necessary, but man do they make life easy. One of the nicest things about them is that you can walk for miles with your line ready to shoot at a moments notice. It beats the heck out of having to strip it off the reel, or try and untangle it after you've carried it around.
You can buy them pretty cheap now, some of the collapsable ones start at around $25, or you can make one for less than $10.
The flats, well, that's a whole nother beast. I've had a ton of fun fishing them, but I haven't spent enough time on them to give you any really quality advice. You'll definatley want to fish the incoming and outgoing tides, but I had just as much luck fishing the slack tides (when water isn't moving) as I did the others. If you're fishing the flats be prepared to see lots and lots of mullet tailing and jumping. The nice thing about them though, is that even though they don't really take flies, there will often times be fish that do amongst them eating up all the little creatures they kick up as the feed on the grass. I caught my first redfish like that. Not long after that a little school of 3 nice pompano came by...lordie let me tell you what a fun fight that was.
Good luck and let us know how you do,
TT.
When I travel, I bring a 24' bungie cord and buy a small plastic mesh basket at the dollar store......And, I would suggest taking a stripping basket with you. It will save you more frustration than you even know, especially if there's any surf. If the water is calm then it's not really necessary, but man do they make life easy. One of the nicest things about them is that you can walk for miles with your line ready to shoot at a moments notice. It beats the heck out of having to strip it off the reel, or try and untangle it after you've carried it around.
You can buy them pretty cheap now, some of the collapsable ones start at around $25, or you can make one for less than $10.
Only about $1.50 and still better that the storebought collapsible baskets
The simpler the outfit, the more skill it takes to manage it, and the more pleasure one gets in his achievements.
--- Horace Kephart
Wifey/SWMBOOriginally Posted by dudley
When I travel, I bring a 24' bungie cord and buy a small plastic mesh basket at the dollar store......
Only about $1.50 and still better that the storebought collapsible basketsput a cabash on any more cash expenditures on fishing equipment so this is a great suggestion
You've received some pretty good advice.
I just got back from fishing the gulf coast from Sarasota to Boca. The most productive fly I had was a #4 olive/white clouser with med red dumbell eyes and rainbow krystal flash. The tail/wing extended about 1 1/2 hook shanks behind the bend. Seemed to be equally effective with floating or sink tip line.
Good luck!
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