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Thread: Petition for Rule Change on NH FFO - Accepted for review

  1. Default Petition for Rule Change on NH FFO - Accepted for review

    I submitted a petition for a rule change to the New Hampshire Fish & Game Department and it passed initial muster with the department! The long process of review - layers of it - and public comment won't start until January.

    Of course, petitions do not necessarily resemble the final presentation to the public; nor the rule as implemented. However, the substance of the petition is as follows:
    ****************
    Petition for Adoption of Rules ? New Rule for Fly Fishing Only Streams

    Pursuant to RSA 541-A:4, the undersigned hereby petitions the State of New Hampshire, Department of Fish and Game, to modify the regulations for existing flowing waters currently designated as "Fly Fishing Only" (FFO) to be upgraded to a new designation of "Traditional Fly Fishing Only" (TFFO) and to add such additional waters as it determines may benefit from the new designation.

    In this brief, we will endeavor to present the myriad benefits of a different approach to Fly Fishing Only than exists under our current rules. Through Traditional Fly Fishing, as defined below, large sections of many of our current FFO designated rivers and streams will become sanctuaries for large trout - growing trophies and reducing the need for intensive, and expensive, stocking.

    The Concept of Trout Sanctuaries

    Until 1991-1992, the FFO sections of New Hampshire rivers had a conservation purpose that no other angling type presented. Because no weight was allowed on line, leader, or fly, the trout in fast water or deep pools never had the fly presented directly to them, it was always passing overhead. Even with an intermediate line, the leader and fly would seldom get deeper than six inches in fast water. Of course, in some back eddies the fly might go deeper, but for the most part, large trout had those waters as "sanctuaries". Lee Wulff, a former member of the NH F&G Commission and renowned writer, defined and promoted this concept of trout sanctuary in his book "Lee Wulff on Flies" (Stackpole, 1980):

    "... we can break fly-fishing down into several classifications, depending upon technique. The first classification is surface fly-fishing, with floating lines and no weight of any kind, in the fly or on the line. The second classification is intermediate fly-fishing, in which weighted flies or sinking-tip fly lines are used, but no attached weight, such as split-shot or sinkers. The third classification is unlimited fly-fishing, in which lead-core sinking lines, weights and sinkers, and weighted flies (and perhaps spinners) are used.

    Of the three classifications of fly-fishing, surface fly-fishing is the most difficult way of taking trout and all the classifications of fly-fishing are more difficult than spinning. With surface fly-fishing all the fish have to be brought to the surface for the lure, and all the deep flowing water is sanctuary for the fish. Any trout caught by surface fly-fishing leaves the sanctuary of its own volition, and unless it leaves, it cannot be caught. This eliminates the drifting of a lure right into the trout's holding level and almost right into its mouth, so that simple curiosity as much as hunger may cause it to mouth the lure. The intermediate fly-fishing classification gives the angler a greater advantage and allows him to drift his flies deeper in the flow, where most of the feeding by the trout is done. The unlimited fly-fishing classification lets an angler have maximum advantage, allowing him to reach the fish at their holding level, and this is particularly deadly on big fish."


    Thomas McGuane, an internationally famous outdoor writer and novelist, wrote in "Live Water" (Meadow Run Press, 1996):

    "In a perfect world, fishing with split shot on the leader wouldn't be fly fishing at all. Neither would monofilament nymphing and maybe even shooting heads. Lee Wulff said that the fish is entitled to the sanctuary of deep water. That's where most of us used to set the bar in trout fishing. We fished on top and tried to devise ways of catching big fish that way, fishing at night, fishing with greater stealth, hunting remote places that rarely saw an angler."


    John Gierach, a modern writer on the subject of fly fishing and the author of many books, wrote in "Good Flies" (Lyons Press, 2002):

    "I still do my share of dredging with weight on the leader - sometimes lots of weight, as much as it takes - but in the past few years I've tried to do it more sparingly. If there's anything wrong with this kind of nymph fishing, it's that it can be too effective. Lee Wulff once said that trout deserve the sanctuary of deep water, and I can't help thinking about that every time I nip three split shot onto my leader and dredge up a fish that might have started rising in an hour or two if I'd left him alone. Maybe there was a time when this didn't make too much difference, but with the crowds you now see on popular rivers - not to mention the beat-up trout you sometimes catch - maybe the idea of letting the fish hide, rest, or feed undisturbed from time to time is worth thinking about."

    So, the concept of sanctuary for trout is neither new, nor logically inconsistent as a practice beneficial to the growth and preservation of large trout.

    Benefits of Traditional Fly Fishing Only Designation

    The introduction of Traditional Fly Fishing Only waters will have sporting, practical, environmental, fiscal, and social benefits to the State of New Hampshire. These include:

    * Free advertising of New Hampshire waters in fishing magazines, journals, and the Internet as sportsmen explore and debate the concept of TFFO.
    * Fly shops will realize an increase in sales of flies and fly-tying materials that meet the criteria of TFFO.
    * Guide services will flourish as newcomers require guides to instruct them on casting and fishing in the traditional manner.
    * Spin fishermen will warmly accept the new regulations. The current FFO regulations allow the use of jigs (Clouser minnows, conehead Muddlers) and other weighted flies which are more safely and easily cast with spinning gear; thus fishermen using a spinning rod justifiably question the fairness of FFO rather than ALO. Since the flies used in Traditional Fly Fishing are too light to cast with spinning tackle, the equity of the new designation will be apparent.
    * Trout will grow larger in the safety of their "sanctuaries."
    * The added cachet of TFFO will resonate with new fly fishermen and the similarity to the fishing prior to 1992 will be attractive to the "old-timers."
    * The Department of Fish and Game will save money in stocking, as the number of fish caught per angler day will be less, but the satisfaction with each catch will be greater.
    * The fishermen who adopt Traditional Fly Fishing methods will be possessive of their waters and will police them themselves, calling upon Conservation Officers as necessary. Thus no additional enforcement checks will be required.
    * Only FFO flowing waters need be altered to TFFO, as ponds and lakes would not realize the same benefits as rivers and streams.


    Proposed Definitions for Traditional Fly Fishing Only Waters:

    Artificial Fly for Traditional Fly Fishing - In waters designated Traditional Fly Fishing Only, a fly shall be constructed on a single hook with a single point dressed with any or all of the following: feathers, fur, hairs, wool, cotton and other grasses, silk, metal tinsel not greater in thickness than five thousands of an inch, rayon or nylon thread or floss. Resin, gum, and nitrocellulose varnishes and lacquers may be applied to the thread of the fly. Epoxy and other synthetic adhesives may not be used. The hook shall have no additional weight affixed, including but not limited to: hooks, natural bait, molded weight, beads, coneheads, dumbbells, spinners, spoons or similar devices.

    Traditional Fly Fishing - A technique for fishing where the weight of the line is used to cast a very light-weight fly that would not be heavy enough to be cast with a spinning or casting rod. No additional weight may be affixed to fly, leader, or line. The line shall be either a floating fly line, or an intermediate fly line with a sink rate of less than one inch per second, to which a leader of Nylon or silkworm gut is affixed. The rod shall be one designed for fly fishing and the reel shall be a single-action fly reel. The fly shall conform to the definition of Artificial Fly for Traditional Fly Fishing (above). No more than three such flies individually attached to the leader may be used. Dropper flies must be attached to the leader by Nylon or silkworm gut droppers no less than eighteen inches apart.

    Clearly, Traditional Fly Fishing Only will bring attention to the finest fishing waters in New Hampshire, both from resident fishermen and out-of-state anglers. The additional challenge and prestige of catching trout under TFFO conditions will increase angler count on the waters, but decrease actual angling pressure on the fish.


    The Petitioner thanks you for your thoughtful consideration of the above and looks forward to your response.

    *********
    Let me know what you think, either by replying to this post or by PM. Perhaps other states could benefit from similar rules?

    Thanks.
    __________________
    Best regards,
    Reed
    http://www.overmywaders.com/


    The Contemplative Angler (Blog)
    Last edited by overmywaders; 11-29-2008 at 03:27 PM. Reason: removed question marks which should have been quotes

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Knoxville, TN
    Posts
    176

    Default

    I may be in the minority, but a regulation like that would certainly keep me away from fishing any of the waters so designated or planning a vacation to fish where I would not be allowed to utilize techniques that I actually enjoy. I personally believe that a regulation like this would bring a division within the fly fishing community - one that we don't need.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Boulder, CO
    Posts
    152

    Default

    I tend to agree with the previous poster in the respect that I would be unlikely to fish waters with regulations that prevented me from using techniques I like, but I live far away from the east coast and am unlikely to go there to fish in any case. I'm also not totally convinced that the new regulations would provide environmental benefits or that the "sanctuary" effect of these regulations would significantly increase either the overall health of fish, their size or their numbers. Besides, this year I replaced the crumbling full wells on one of my old beater grangers with a non-traditional fatter-than-normal half wells grip, and I don't want to be blacklisted!

    On the other hand though, I think there's room for all sorts of different approaches and if you and your neighbors and other NH sportsmen want to set aside some areas for traditional techniques only, more power to you! I love to see flyfishers who are excited about their local waters. We need more people who care about rivers and fish, and one way to achieve that is by giving local folks more input into how their natural resources are regulated. If you haven't already, you should float the idea in front of local clubs and organizations to get more information. Maybe you can even finagle some firm or group into providing you with an EIA, which would give you more ammo when you go up against the bureaucrats.

    It's an interesting idea. I'm curious to see how it turns out.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    Poulsbo, Washington State, U.S.A.
    Posts
    4,387

    Default

    I always heard that C-4 did a bang up job on trout and was exciting as well. I suppose someone will rule against that too.
    Oh, by the way, we have streams out here ya can't wade in and ya can't use any lead either. Some places oversea ya can only fish up stream,,, and only to a fish that is rising and only with a dry fly. Talk about rules...

    Actually, the 'rules' are simply control methods used by the fish/game boys to best manage the resource. Various rules can provide various results. Usually, man hours of recreation is usually a desired ratio. To allow each to fish as they wanted would be outlandish and would soon eliminate the need for any further rules, ever. Rules are a necessary part of a civilized society.
    However, if any rules are proposed or instituted for vanity reasons I am fundamentally and vehemently against such.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North west arkansas
    Posts
    21

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    it would be more traditional if you outlawed string or any kind of line also . Only catch a trout with your right hand as he jumps out of the water to the left and upstream .

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Rock Springs, Wyo., USA
    Posts
    1,672

    Default rules

    I am a dry fly fisher most of the time, but this sounds a bit on the extreme side of rules. It certainly turns me off to ever wanting to fish these waters!
    Wyo-Blizzard

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Lake In The Hills. IL USA
    Posts
    4,010

    Default

    Hey REED,
    Good to "hear" from you again. Were this elongated "rule change " proposal authored by anyone else, I would have ignored it as too long and tedious to read. Being, however, that it IS you who authored it, I "readily" read it and support the premise, whatever it is

  8. #8

    Default

    Sounds just like dry fly or nothing elitist snobbery to me. How about this for a rule: YOU fly fish the way YOU want to and YOU let the rest of the world fly fish the way WE want to?
    That sounds like a rule that the vast majority of us can live with.
    Self absorbed, overly inflated, egotistical attitudes like you just posted are a large part of the reason that many who do not fly fish think that all of us are a bunch of snobs.
    And, just in case this response appears to be harsh and or insulting: Please carefully read the original post. Then decide who is insulting who.
    Last edited by flybop; 11-29-2008 at 09:52 AM. Reason: spelling

  9. #9

    Thumbs down

    Traditional fly fishing is fine...if that is what you like. But my opinion is that everyone likes to put their own slant on things to make it more enjoyable to them. In other words...it's fishing! I think I should be able to enjoy it my way. I agree with a previous poster that these 'rules' would turn me off in a big way!
    Brook trout always remind me that there must be a higher power.

    Dale

  10. Default

    Thanks for all the great input. Because FAOL has readers from all over the world, it is possible that stream conditions and fishing laws vary tremendously from what we have here in New Hampshire. Our present Fly Fishing Only sections of river are high-gradient, over granite bedrock and boulders; some riffles, rapids, flats, pocket water, and pools. Prior to 1992, the fish had the protection of holding in the fast water and the deep pools, because no weight was allowed. You worked hard for your fish, but it made each more valuable. (As JC quotes - "It is in working within limits that the master reveals himself" ~ Oscar Wilde)

    Once weight was allowed in 1992, the catch rate was much higher - because the fish lost their sanctuaries - but the quality of the fish, both in appearance (now often torn and scarred) and size, diminished, in my experience.

    Just some background. Now, please continue your excellent input. Thanks.

    Best regards,
    Reed
    http://www.overmywaders.com/


    The Contemplative Angler (Blog)

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