Color Preserver Question

[Joe Valencic]

I've been practicing my wrapping on an old factory rod, and made two wraps using the same threads. One got a coat of color preserver and the other did not. Both received an application of Flex Coat and the results are here:



Aside from personal preference, a lot of what I read points overwhelmingly to NOT using CP on wraps. Any reason or opinions on this, or have I just encountered a lot of builders from the non-CP camp?

Sorry for the blur, but the camera wanted to focus on the bench and not the rod. The color differential is what's important, and that's evident even though it's out of focus.

Joe

[dleo6446]

Joe, you will hear arguments on both sides of the fence I am sure. Preferentially, I go without preservers unless I am doing a restoration on a rod that was originally finished with actual thread color rather than translucent finishes. It is my opinion that color preservers, for the most part, prohibit good adhesion of the finish to the rod. there are preservers that will penetrate and set up good adhesion of the thread to the blank but they are getting hard to find, and even though you do get some color preservation with them, the color will change ever so slightly (more depending on the color of the thread. Lots of folks wrap graphite and glass with NCP thread, but even then you will see some slight changes in color on some colors.

I won't argue one side or the other quite frankly, but my preference is no color preserver!

[Joe Valencic]

dleo,

I hadn't thought about adhesive properties of the CP. Guess I just figured what sticks stays stuck. Do you mean that it will actually separate from the rod surface in time, or not adhere at all? Would scuffing the blank under the wraps make a difference in adhesion? So many questions, so little time.

Joe

[fishbum]

Joe

I have been building rods since 1976 and have used most color preservers that have been available over the last 30 years. I think the shyness for color preserver is that a lot of people can't get consistant results with the stuff. It takes practice to get good results.

I only had a couple of bad experiance with some thread and preserver combinations. For the most part, I have had very good results.

I used to do a lot of decorative butt wraps. Some took several days to accomplish. Color preserver is a must. Penitration through 2 to 4 layers of thread is a must. On some of those wraps that I have removed, I had penitration all the way to the blank. I don't buy the adhesion argument. How tight does a guide wrap have to stick to the blank?

I have had one rod in 30 years have a failure on some guide wraps. I attributed that to the fact that after 7 years of being tossed into the bed of a pickup and being bounced around on the bottom of this guys john boat the wraps just plane were wore out. The rod looked like crap. The repair was not a warranty repair but I didn't charge the guy. He hase since purchased 4 more rods from me.

Call me sometime and If you have some questions about getting good results with color preserver.

fishbum

[dleo6446]

Joe, what I have found is that it doesn't penetrate the thread very well an set up a bond between the thread and the blank. Once again, that is for most of the color preservers out there. There are some that are lacquer based that will penetrate and create adhesion, but the water based just doesn't do a very good job of it. I think most folks will tell you that if you don't use enough of the color preserver, you will also get some bleeding and color variations in the finished wraps as well after the epoxy goes on. Quite frankly, I can't think of a single rod manufacturer out there today that is using color preserver on its wraps, but I am sure that is a cost savings issue more than anything else...eliminate a step, save a buck...or maybe 2 or 3!!

[clyde holmes]

In no way am I even close to Leo can do. However my 2cents, I always use cloor preserver. The rods Ive done havent been fished that much and mayby problems will arise. For now I will continue to use it. I dont feel ready to try transperant wraps yet

[Joe Valencic]

fishbum & dleo,

Thanks for your comments. As far as factory rods go, I can see the time savings by removing the CP step in finishing. I also think that the factory rods are built to fish, and there is little originality in the thread work, so there's nothing to really highlight on the factory rod. After all, that's why the custom builder exists at all. The CP I'm using thins with alcohol, so I think it fits into your OK catagory.

I plan on developing some degree of competency with thread work, and plan on having that work on display...not faded into the blank. That's just my preference.

fishbum, I'll give you a call some evening and get the "CP 101" from you. Thanks for the offer.

Joe

[Joe Valencic]

Here's my point about hiding the beauty of wrapping and color display:

BEFORE COATING



AFTER COATING



I won't waste my time next time of including green and yellow banding, just to have it wash into the background. It was good practices developing narrow banding, but it's all lost w/o CP.

Joe

[rainbowchaser]

Sometimes you can deliberately omit color preserver because you want the darker color that results. I have done this in cases where I wanted the thread to come out matching the color of the blank with good results.

[PaGuy]

Joe, I dont use cp. I think if you plan for the fading it looks really good. But I like more of a understated look.