H&H Rod Kits and Questions

[RCaillouet3]

Hello all, thanks for any help in this!

I am looking at buying one of Hook and Hackle's Forecast rod kits. This will be my first build, and have read that they seem to very good for that. I have also read the article here on FAOL about how to build a rod.

I mainly stay in warmwater (panfish and small bass.) Fly line that I would like to use would be the SA headstart line. I currently own a 9' #6 Sage VPS that I LOVE!!!! I am wanting something for a winter project and this seems to be the one thing the wife might let me invest in. I fish mostly from bank of farm ponds, or occasionally from my pontoon boat (whenever I can get my 11 year old from out of it!) I am also looking at purchasing a float tube
so 9' is a must!!!


Rod Kit I am looking at: Forecast 9' #4 weight.

So now the questions questions!

1. Is there an appreciable difference in the feel of a #4 weight to my #6 weight when it comes to fighting panfish and bass species?? I guess my question is will it be more difficult to land bluegill and bass with the #4 than with my #6, to the point that I will say -- WOW!!!!!

OR, should I go with a 9' #3 weight and just go with a different / more expensive line??? I am only looking at SA Headstart for it is the line I use on my #6, and for the fishing I do it is ideal in both performance and price!!!


2. Does anyone know what kind of action the rods from H&H have?? My Sage VPS has a med-fast action and I love the way it feels to cast and fish!!! I have tried to use rods that are more on the soft side, and frankly I just find them harder to feel when the rod loads correctly!

3. If the action isn't as fast as I would like, could I go with dual foot guides to make it a little stiffer? Same question if the rod is too fast, could I go with single foot guides to make it a little less stff and thus a little slower???

By that same token, would a 3 or 4 piece rod make the action a little faster from having to thread 1 or 2 more ferules???


4. Other than the look of an uplock real seat as compared to normal, is there any real difference in performance of the 2 reel seats?

5. I am leaning towards single foot guides for the rod (less thread wrapping,) is this a mistake for a first time rod builder?

6. Is finding the spine very hard? I am really worried about getting it right, so that I don't end up with a bad rod!

7. With multi piece rods, is it okay just to put the pieces together then find the spine for the entire rod? Or, do you have to find the spine for each section, and then line them all up and double check the spine of the rod?

8. I know that the ferrules on a multi piece rod or the weak points on the rod. I know that they must be thread wrapped over for strength. Will wrapping this with enough section of wraps be easy to figure out in order to make the areas strong enough?


9. Now for a question I must say might be purely opinion. Is a #4 easy to feel load and cast? My #6 is the SMALLEST flyrod I have EVER used!!! I come from southern Louisiana where my 9.5' #9 weight ruled the inshore seas!!! Now I live in the central Kentucky area and am having a fun time "downsizing" my equipment to match local conditions.

10. As I know that I am not the best person to do it, I am going to have a good instructor teach my daughter to cast a fly rod. She loves to tie flies with me, and is itching to try using them. Would a 9' #4 be easier for her to learn on than my 9' #6? She'll be fishing with simple dryflies, and maybe an occasional nymph with indicator.

11. Lastly, do I really need some kind of motorized attachment to spin the rod while the guide glue dries? Or is it easy / feasible to do it by hand?

Thanks for the help!!!


Sincerely,

Reggie




[This message has been edited by RCaillouet3 (edited 27 July 2005).]

Here's my opinions on some of your questions:
1. I think so. If you are going to be throwing larger flies, or in windier conditions, the 6 is noticably less work than a 4. I don't usually have to cast overly far, so I use a 4 for the most part, but if I think I'll be into more bass than bluegills, I use the 6.

2. I don't know about the 9' Forecast 4 weights, but I really like the 7 1/2 and 8 footers. They are med/fast. I'd opt for the 7'6" or 8' option, even in a tube. Just learn to keep your backcast up. A longer rod isn't the only solution.

3. I think that is kind of backwards from my experience. Double foot guides mean double thread and finish, which puts more weight onto your rod and will reduce performance. Best performance is the lightest guides and wraps that you can come up with. Blank design these days has reached a point where the extra ferrules won't impact your rod action like it did in the past. More sections don't necessarily mean stiffer.

5. Not at all. I use single foot guides a lot, either with ceramic rings or single foot snakes. I usually try to put a locking wrap on them, though.

6. It isn't difficult at all.

7. Spine each section individually.

8. I usually wrap 2 times the diameter, or whatever the blank maker suggests, whatever is longer.

9. I think it is just as easy, just different.

11. Hand rotating is very effective, but more time consuming.

I'll send you an e-mail on some other things, too.

RCaillouer3;
Just finishing my first rod. An H&H 9' 3 wgt. IM6. This rod is intended to be used from my float tube for Blue Gills.

The build was quite a learning experiance so I strongly suggest getting the vidio. A member in CA. sent me one that realy helped and I have just passed it back to another member in CA.

Getting the wraps down is, or was, difficullt for me. I mixed my final thread coat epoxy wrong and it did not dry in two days!! Had to give it another coat this afternoon, I hope I got it right this time?!

The IM6 kit was reccomended by a friend that builds rods. "It's been around a long time and proven". The cost was about $70.00 and you get enough epoxy to do 4 more rods.

Somewhere in FAOL "Rod Building" is a discription of a Mouse Trap Thread Tensioner.
It works!

I had an electric rotisserie I bought at a garage sale for $0.50 and turned it in to a rod dryier. It's grinding away behind me.

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I feel more like I do now than I did when I got here!

Cactus AKA "Lucky Dog (Pirate Name)"

[This message has been edited by Jack Hise (edited 28 July 2005).]

[This message has been edited by Jack Hise (edited 28 July 2005).]

Chris;
It went Priority Mail yesterday! You should have it tomorrow.
That video may end up with more miles than the space shuttle!
If you have an old rod or a piece of 1/4" dowel rod get it out. You can practice your wraps along with the video. Run the thread through an book for tension.

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I feel more like I do now than I did when I got here!

Cactus AKA "Lucky Dog (Pirate Name)"

[flyfisherjoe]

Gee Reggie, that's a long list of questions!

1.) there will be enough difference to notice from the 6 to a 4, a 3wt will have a little more. Either will equal more fun. The lighter rod will not toss larger flies as easily but will be a pleasure to fish all day.

2.) I think you'll be happy with the IM6 or 7 blanks from Hook & Hackle. Call Bob and ask him how they compare to your favorite rod.

3.) I feel the main difference between the single foot and snake guides is the look. Use whatever you like and don't expect huge performance differences.

I also feel modern 3 and 4 piece blank designs maintain the same performance as their 2 piece counterparts.

4.) An uplock seat is probably more popular for the rod you will be building but, if you'd rather ... well it's your rod.

5.) Single foot might mean less wrapping and less weight but you'll get twice the experience with snakes, maybe twice the fun?

6.) Finding the spine can be difficult especially on a 4 piece, but that's a good thing because it means modern blanks are so well made that the spline in not a big thing to worry about

7.) I would say, try to find it as best you can, then put all the pieces together. Make sure the assembled blank is straight. If not, adjust it even if it disagrees a little with your spline markings. Then rotate the rod to the position that it bends the most down. Place your guides on the top of that position.

8.) I usually wrap at least an inch at the ferrule, maybe more for larger diameter rods. Look at some of your other rods for an idea of that and the guides.

9.) The main difference in the feel is how effortless the 4 will cast compared to the 9.

10.) A lighter weight rod will be easier for your daughter, less fatigue.

11.) You can just rotate it by hand every once in a while while the epoxy cures but I prefer using a motorized device. It doesn't get distracted and forget to turn!


Here's a page with some Learning Links to good tutorials and information:
[url=http://www.sbflyfishers.com/rodclass.htm:9fd3c]http://www.sbflyfishers.com/rodclass.htm[/url:9fd3c]

Have fun Reggie!

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Joe

[RCaillouet3]

Thank you all for the advise!!!!

I am going to be ordering the kit this afternoon!!!


Thanks for making me feel better about all of this!! I will keep you all posted as to my progress!!!

Sincerely,

Reggie