When does a fly become a lure?

[CoachBob]

A great fly fisherman/tyer named Tom Nixon didn't see much of a distinction. Look up the thread "Tom Nixon Patterns" and his book is cited as well as a couple of web locations to see his flies. For instance: http://laflyfish.com/flies/tom-nixon-spinner.php. I think Czech nymphing ended the distinction between fly and lure. Since you don't have to cast a Czech nymph, that prerequisite is gone. Since some Czech nymphs are a bit of lead dressed up or a jig equivalent, they can be cast with a small spinning reel. A fly is a lure and some lures are flies.

[Rick Z]

Last summer I was in NE Iowa on vacation. Had a DNr guy stop and ask if I was fishing.
Showed him my liscense and all. Also showed him a "fly" I tie with soft plastic luminescent beads and a sivler 00 blade.
He said it was a lure. Since he would write the ticket that I would have to pay I did not use it on any fly only water.
It may be more important what the "Game Warden" thinks that what we determine.

Rick

[Uncle Jesse]

Rick,

You are a wise man. I would venture a guess it is a rare situation where the local justice court judge and game warden disagree on definitions very often. Of course, a lot depends upon the attitude of the officer at any moment in time, some might be understanding of a tourist and others may count a tourist as a trophy. A few years back I received a speed ticket back home in MS, I called the courthouse to find out how large a check to send them.

The lady at the courthouse asked "Who got you?" I told her the badge number, she replied "Oh, it was Moore. His dad was a state trooper, rumor was he had given his mother a speeding ticket."

I replied "So I had not chance."

She said "None at all." The good news the ticket was only $80, a small fraction of what they are around here and it was earned and probably a little over due after 40 years of driving without getting one.

[redietz]

It may be more important what the "Game Warden" thinks that what we determine.

Perhaps. Many states have exlicit definitions of what constitutes a "fly" for purposes of fly only water, and while they vary, most that I've seen specifically exclude blades. It's not just the warden's opinion. What an angler chooses to mean by "fly" -- a category of "lure" is his own opinion; what the law says isn't.

[Byron haugh]

I rarely fish streamer patterns, myself, but would certainly classify streamer patterns as "flies" and the fishing of them with a fly rod as "fly fishing"...,,,,

my "fly" pattern books have many streamer patterns.

and, although I did not, what is the first "fly" many/most tiers first tie? A Wooly Bugger/Wooly Worm??

anyone know what a "Walt's Dace" is and who developed it?

[Allan]

Byron,

"anyone know what a "Walt's Dace" is and who developed it? "

Yes and yes.

[redietz]

"anyone know what a "Walt's Dace" is and who developed it? "

Yes and yes.

Agreed.

[Byron haugh]

Bob,
Not sure what you mean by "agreed".
I doubt Walt Dette would call his "Walt's Dace" anything other than a ""fly".

[redietz]

Bob,
Not sure what you mean by "agreed".
I doubt Walt Dette would call his "Walt's Dace" anything other than a ""fly".

I meant with Allan that someone (for example me) knows what it is and whom it's name after.
I also expect that Walt Dette (who was not the Walt after whom the streamer was named, but was the Walt who invented it) called it a streamer.

[Byron haugh]

Eric Leiser (fairly knowledgeable fly tier) who wrote the book about the Dette's lists some bucktails and streamers tied by the Dette's in his book about them. I think they considered these to be flies - both Leiser and the Dette's:
A streamer or a buck tail is a sub-set of flies. Like a dry fly is, or a nymph is, but they are flies in their pure form.



A second page of the listing of Bucktails and Stremers tied by the Dettes: