Tenkara Carp!

[CM_Stewart]

YouTube video showing carp fishing with TenkaraUSA Amago and Daiwa 53MF. The Tenkara Guides in Salt Lake City show how it's done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UX4s3...ature=youtu.be

[moonlitflies]

I guess I will have to take a gander on some Carp! We have some really good Carp fishing here in Idaho, and not to far me either.

Tight line,
Brandon

[Paul Arnold]

I was really surprised to note that the Daiwa rod being used at the end was 63 decimeters long. That is almost 21 feet. I have not yet seen that in your lineup, Chris. It sounded as if he (Erik?) said that it was a Kiyose, but I may have misunderstood that.

[CM_Stewart]

It is 53 decimeters. It is a Daiwa Kiyose 53MF which is a zoom rod that can be fished at 4.8m (15.75') or 5.3m (17.25') and is the next longer length to the Daiwa 43MF I just listed this week. Erik was looking for a big water / big fish rod to use in the Green River One Fly competition and I was looking for someone who regularly catches bigger fish than I do to put the rod through it's paces and see what it can handle. He didn't hook any monster trout so he took it carp fishing. It seems to handle carp just fine.

It isn't on the website yet because I had just gotten in a very few rods for evaluation. Erik has one, I have one and one is doing a little surf casting in Equador. The video coming out now does kind of catch me flat footed. I do plan on stocking the rod, though. From the very first introduction of tenkara into the US, there have been requests for rods that could handle bigger fish. About that time, there was a video from Shimano making the rounds that showed a guy in Alaska or Canada catching steelhead with a rod that looked a lot like a tenkara rod on steroids. TenkaraUSA and I were quick to say, no no, that's not tenkara, but the desire to catch bigger fish than a tenkara rod can handle didn't go away.

Since I've come to realize that whether a fishing style is or isn't tenkara (pure tenkara) is of no particular importance if it is fun, I've started handling requests for big fish rods differently. (It is important if you are trying to preserve purity or protect market share. It is not important if you just want to go fishing.) Most of the very long and very strong Japanese rods are horrendously expensive, but the Kiyose MF series is pretty reasonably priced - within reach of someone who wants to give carp fishing a try - and certainly much less expensive than it would be to buy a new 8 or 9 weight fly rod, reel, and line. There is a 63MF in the series, which is almost 21 feet long at full extension, but I wanted to try the 53MF first and go to the longer rod only if the limits of the 53 aren't sufficient to handle the fish people want to catch. Pushing envelopes is a step by step process.

It is tenkara fishing but it isn't a tenkara rod. It is a keiryu rod but it isn't keiryu fishing. I think I'll call it "fishing." I suspect any day now the people who want to preserve the purity of keiryu fishing will complain that I am bastardizing their sport.

You can always tell the pioneers. They're the ones with the arrows in their backs.

[Paul Arnold]

I wonder how that extra length and strength of the 43 & the 53 affect the size tippet one can safely use. 4X? 3X? Or might those rods risk the same tip-sticking problems that a Soyokaze might have with strong leaders?

You can always tell the pioneers. They're the ones with the arrows in their backs.
They are also the ones who own the land nearest to the river.

[CM_Stewart]

I believe there are three risks from having too strong a tippet. Getting the tip section completely stuck is certainly one, another is having the lillian pulled off. The most serious would be having the rod itself break from trying to stop a fish that is too strong for the rod but not too strong for the tippet.

Most of the rod breakages I've heard of are not from too strong a tippet, although I don't know how many stuck tips might be. I routinely break off 5X (4.7# test) tippet by pulling back on my rods (with the entire rod in a straight line with the line and tippet) when my fly is snagged and I can't reach the line to pull back on it directly. That is on a rod where the "recommended" tippet breaking strength is between .8 and 2.4# test. I've never gotten the tip on one of those rods stuck.

The tippet Erik was using to catch the carp was 4X. I think you'd be safe with that on the 43MF or 53MF, but I would hesitate to recommend 3X. I'm also not sure you'd need 3X, but then again I don't know. New ground is being broken and there isn't much accumulated wisdom yet with respect to what you can get away with.

[Paul Arnold]

Thanks, Chris. A helpful response, as always. ~pfa

[scorpion1971]

Chris, now my curiosities have been picked. Do you think the 53MF will have enough backbone to land steelhead and salmon. Or even smaller stripped bass or wipers? It is not that often I fish for these but have on occasions. I do know they are using 6lb test mono here in the creeks for the steelies but that is on spinning gear with a drag system. I have looked at these rods before but was not sure of the weight of these. I am sure that the more backbone a rod has the heavier it might be.

[CM_Stewart]

I have never caught a steelhead, so I have no experience to draw on. I had an email exchange with an angler earlier this evening who said he has had steelhead break off when he was using 1X and 0X tippet with his 8 wt fly rod. I do not think the rod would be strong enough to stand up to force that would break 0X. (I do know of a somewhat similar rod that is rated for 12# test tippet, but it is a more expensive rod).

The Kiyose 53MF weighs 4.2 ounces without the tip cap (4.5 ounces with it).

I am confident that the rod could stand up to smaller stripers and wipers. The fish shown here was caught with a Kiyose 36SF, which is a less capable rod than the 43MF. I think it qualifies as "smaller."

kiyose-striper.jpg

[scorpion1971]

Thanks again Chris. I guess I will have to stick with the 8wt and the switch rod then for the steelies. I may have to get me one of the 53MF's when you get them in stock to sell.