Dry Supply

[teachmarkey]

Hey all,

I know the big dogs of the industry like Whiting have terrific quality necks, capes, etc., but as every tyer knows, the prices are still insane. So what would be the problem with going with imported? I have seen terrific flies on this forum, but my skills aren't museum quality. I'd like to continue to grow my tying skills, but I'm mainly tying flies for fish, not for show.

So with some companies offering imported dry fly necks for eight bucks, why not go with them instead of paying hundred? I'd like to hear from the many experts here.

Thanks!
Hugh

[MSD53X]

HI Teach;
I've never tried the imported feathers. But if I was looking for more I would contact Conranch Hackle first. Their contact info is on the sponsors page.
Good luck with whatever you decide, and please keep us posted.

[51BC]

Ther is a huge gap between an $8 neck and a $100 neck. While you and I may not need the $100 feathers, the $8 ones are usually not the bargain they seem. Better to look in the $40-$60 range. A hearty second to check Conranch.

[mickalo]

I've purchased many hackles,Saddles & Capes from Conranch, and have never been dissappointed. And Denny's prices are very affortable.

Mike

[gqualls]

I'm not an expert by no means .... two important difference between the genetic hackle and the imported hackle will be barb count on the stem and the stem thickness. The genetic hackle has high barb counts per inch and the stem is much smaller/thinner than imported hackle. The stem thickness make a lot of difference when tying off the fly and trying to get a nice, neat head on it. If you are tying smallish dry flies go with the better hackle. If you are tying woolly buggers the imported feather ought to work just fine.

[Kytroutbum]

The imported necks usually only tie larger sizes and many times you'll have to use two hackles to get the same density. A large portion of the neck will be to large for a trout fly and will go into tailing or popper, bass bug hackles. That being said, I use them for Humpies, Wulff's, Variants and my Parachutes. I am selective when I purchase an imported neck- check stiffness, and hackle sizes. I take a hackle guage into a flyshop with me! Good Imported necks offer the opportunity for a diversity of necks at a less expensive price realizing there are limitations with them. I have several good genetic necks, 100 packs, etc but use them only when I feel a lower quality neck will not suffice.

A lot of us started out tying in the 60's by buying neck loose neck hackles by the ounce from Herter's and we caught fish, even though the flies were larger.

Look into using capes, I like Keogh's, rather than saddles. I've gone into tying comparaduns also. Also, if you are tying two different hackles, ex. griz and brown on Adams, Use a high quality one and a "lower" quality to get the coloration.

Randall Sale
the Kytroutbum

[Longs for Cutts]

You get what you pay for with hackle, ALMOST now including the saddles again. They are starting to reappear in fly shops at just above their previous price. A contemporary genetic hackle, even a neck hackle, will tie at least 2 flies, and the saddles can tie close to a dozen, all with much thinner stems, heavier barb density, glossier barbs, and less web than either older genetic hackle or Indian gamecock necks, which is what the imported stuff is. There's a reason a lot of old fly patterns call for 2-4 hackles even when they were the same color, and it's because they were using non-genetic hackle and could only get 2-3 turns out of each feather.

That said, if you don't tie thousands of flies per year for retail sale like I do, there's no reason to go top of the line or even buy full skins. In fact, most commercial tyers I know don't even do that. Look at the #3/Bronze grade stuff out there, the new Whiting High & Dry series (what they used to sell to 3rd party vendors), and half-necks. Buy necks or half necks rather than saddles for a wider range of hook sizes, and if you find yourself tying a whole lot of one size of something and require more hackle in one color/size, get a few Whiting 100 packs.

[rainbowchaser]

I find the Indian necks most useful for tying larger flies like Hex's. It takes several hackles for one fly. They usually won't tie down below a 12 or 14 and there won't be many of those. The cost of hackle per fly is greater than buying genetic necks because you get a lot fewer useful feathers for each dollar. I would not mail order them at all. The quality varies too much. An alternative for a practice neck would be to find someone who breeds bantams or better yet fighting cocks (Some of the people involved with the fighting cocks may be dangerous) and buy a carefully chosen rooster. My experience is that the meat is only good for dog food but the cape is comparable to the Indian necks

[Buddy Sanders]

Teach,

If it was just a matter of initial cost, then the imported necks would seem like a 'good deal'. But there is more to the equation. The best 'value' if you look at 'cost per fly' is in the highest grade, or 'most expensive' hackles. That's because the major growers grade on hackle density, thus while the initial cost is higher, you actually get more feathers per dollar with the #1s or 'Gold' level hackles. One of the guys from Whiting once told me that a top end neck would tie several HUNDRED MORE flies than the next lower grade....

That being said, there are good reasons to buy imported necks. There are useable feathers on them. If you tie various types of flies, not just dries for trout, then you will have a use for all the feathers. They are inexpensive initially. You can gather a good stock of different colors without spending too much. I disagree on the sizes available in the imported necks. Almost all of mine will have a few dozen size 20s on them, and progressively more 18s, 16s, etc..

If you want hackle for dry flies, though, they aren't even close to your best value. Go with the 100 packs or split saddles or necks if you are on a budget, buy brown, grizzly, and dun, and you can tie everything you need for 90% of trout dries without spending a fortune.

Good Luck!

Buddy

[gadabout]

I sympathize with the OP's concern. While you could argue that the genetic necks are more cost-effective over the long haul, this assumes that you are going to use up the whole neck. For commercial tyers this may be a no-brainer, but for the average tier that just ties to supply himself or herself with fishing flies, it doesn't always make sense to buy expensive genetic necks. When I started out tying over 30 years ago, I found imported necks that were of sufficient quality to tie good flies. So what if I had to use two hackles on one fly? Over the years, I eventually bought genetic necks for the colors I use most frequently. But I still have most of the imported necks and they still work. Most of us want to be able to accumulate all the materials needed to tie any fly that we need or that strikes our fancy. But not all of those things are going to get used often enough to justify an "investment" in a high-priced item.