How do you cast without being able to stand? or more acurately fish small waters.....

[Nighthawk]

flyguy66,
I own a variety of rods from 5' up to 9' in length. That is why I mentioned switching to the longer rods, not buying as I already own them. I have 5,6,7, and 8 weight lines in WF-F, an 8 weight intermediate sink tip and both 6 and 8 wt DT-F. I am one of these guys that preferred the short to medium length rods say the 5 foot rod up to and including my 7'6" 7wt glass. I may be able at tax time to pick up something off of ebay in the tenkara area but it wont be anything expensive for sure. The shorter rods worked better on the brush choked native brook trout streams in our county but my wading days are gone. I do not trust my sense of balance enough to wade.

You know what kind of pain I am in. I have bilateral facet disease, osteoarthritis, osteoporosis, degenerative disc disease, epidural lipomatosis, multiple dessicated and collapsed discs along with two herniated discs. L4-L5 disc is partially collapsed while L5-S1 disc has totally collapsed resulting in the shifting of the vertebrae, stenosis, pinched nerves and bone on bone. Also have the same things going on in the thoracic region. I ain't complaining though just saying if you know what I mean. I am thankful just to be alive every day. Thankful to folks like you for helping me too. My dad just turned 80 on the 23rd. His favorite saying is "We're in pretty good shape, for the shape we're in".


I will say a prayer for you.

[Nighthawk]

Eric, if you don't already have one get yourself either a double taper or "easy mend" fly line. I can roll cast using a weight forward line but find it so much easier with a double taper.

And from one veteran to another, I know you'll do just fine. Heck you've been through allot worse experience than what you are going through now.

Dave

Dave,
I have just the setup. A 9 foot, 2pc, 6wt medium-fast mid flex graphite rod with a DT-6-F Cortland Sylk on it. I also have a 9' glass that is a bit slower, 7wt that I would will to try my DT-8-F on just for chuckles. Anyone that has ever seen me cast is going to chuckle at the very least.

[anglerdave]

Dave,
I have just the setup. A 9 foot, 2pc, 6wt medium-fast mid flex graphite rod with a DT-6-F Cortland Sylk on it. I also have a 9' glass that is a bit slower, 7wt that I would will to try my DT-8-F on just for chuckles. Anyone that has ever seen me cast is going to chuckle at the very least.

Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

Sounds like you have a good set up, although I am not familiar with Sylk fly line. I thought that line was for bamboo and glass rods. But if it works, it works!

[cycler68]

Nighthawk,
I'm wondering if tenkara fishing wouldn't be a good option for you. I watched a video posted on the TenkaraUSA blog that showed an expert tenkara fisherman casting. He used much less arm movement that is necessary with a conventional fly rod. Would that help?

[DG]

Back to your original question. You don't need to stand to cast. How many of us cast in tubes and toons, without a problem? If your normal casting style is full-body movement, it may present a problem, but many people, myself included, keep the cast out in our arms most of the time. Just takes practice.

[flyguy66]

Yep. I understand your medical condition very well. Your detailed diagnosis and mine aren't that different, but yours is more severe. The nerve impingement and chronic pain, loss of control and sensitivity we deal with is probably about the same in the arms/neck. And I have a facets problem at the bottom of my lumbar spine from a motorcycle accident a couple of years ago.

Now I understand your questions a lot better. I will still say that I think you will find the Tenkara option very enjoyable for small streams when/if you can come up with about $100 to get in to it. It takes a different mental approach to use a 10-13' rod on brushy small streams than what you're used to, but it works great. Using what you've got on hand, let me give you a few tips about how to get the most of what you've got:

1. The roll casting tips you've gotten here are good advice. Take those DT lines and pair them up to your longest rods, over-lining if necessary. Try not to under-line them, as that will force you to work harder to get the same load on the rod. Over-line too much, and a rod will "collapse" or "break down" under load. That means it just loses its parabolic curvature and no longer distributes the energy smoothly along the rod blank. This will cause a serious loss in energy transfer, increased vibration, etc. You'll feel it. Learn to be a master of the roll cast and even single-handed spey casting. You will be nothing short of amazed at what you can do without ever picking up a back cast!

2. Remember: it is all technique and none of it is about power. A 4' tall, 65 lb 100 year old lady could cast a fly 100' if she wanted to. So resolve to do nothing that isn't from a totally relaxed position that is easy and smooth to execute. The key word is smoooooth.

3. I assume from what has been said in this thread that you are a disabled vet. ??? If this is true, AFFI could assist you in getting assistive and adaptive sports equipment from the VA at no cost to you. Just like anything with the VA, this process takes time, there are a few steps, and there is paperwork. But there are some pretty incredible pieces of equipment out there...they're just expensive.

[Nighthawk]

Nighthawk,
I'm wondering if tenkara fishing wouldn't be a good option for you. I watched a video posted on the TenkaraUSA blog that showed an expert tenkara fisherman casting. He used much less arm movement that is necessary with a conventional fly rod. Would that help?

You know the more I think about it the more it appeals to me. I will check it out. Thanks.

Back to your original question. You don't need to stand to cast. How many of us cast in tubes and toons, without a problem? If your normal casting style is full-body movement, it may present a problem, but many people, myself included, keep the cast out in our arms most of the time. Just takes practice.

Yeah I do too in my canoe but should I go with longer rods? That is the only time I use them because most of my fishing is wading done on small brushy streams or small still waters where I can use my shorter rods. I am pretty much resigned to giving up on wading because I cannot stand for any amount of time past a few minutes and I do not trust my balance.

My casting style is more upper body that anything. I used to stand feet shoulder width apart, left foot slightly forward of the right. Kind of like a shooting stance. Elbow tucked enough to hold the family bible against the side of my chest.

Between the pain, the pain meds and the lack of sleep I don't know if I am articulating this in a sensible manner. What is boils down to is since I am mainly going to pass from a seated position should I use the longer rods? I think I should. Thanks.

[Nighthawk]

Yep. I understand your medical condition very well. Your detailed diagnosis and mine aren't that different, but yours is more severe. The nerve impingement and chronic pain, loss of control and sensitivity we deal with is probably about the same in the arms/neck. And I have a facets problem at the bottom of my lumbar spine from a motorcycle accident a couple of years ago.

Now I understand your questions a lot better. I will still say that I think you will find the Tenkara option very enjoyable for small streams when/if you can come up with about $100 to get in to it. It takes a different mental approach to use a 10-13' rod on brushy small streams than what you're used to, but it works great. Using what you've got on hand, let me give you a few tips about how to get the most of what you've got:

1. The roll casting tips you've gotten here are good advice. Take those DT lines and pair them up to your longest rods, over-lining if necessary. Try not to under-line them, as that will force you to work harder to get the same load on the rod. Over-line too much, and a rod will "collapse" or "break down" under load. That means it just loses its parabolic curvature and no longer distributes the energy smoothly along the rod blank. This will cause a serious loss in energy transfer, increased vibration, etc. You'll feel it. Learn to be a master of the roll cast and even single-handed spey casting. You will be nothing short of amazed at what you can do without ever picking up a back cast!

2. Remember: it is all technique and none of it is about power. A 4' tall, 65 lb 100 year old lady could cast a fly 100' if she wanted to. So resolve to do nothing that isn't from a totally relaxed position that is easy and smooth to execute. The key word is smoooooth.

3. I assume from what has been said in this thread that you are a disabled vet. ??? If this is true, AFFI could assist you in getting assistive and adaptive sports equipment from the VA at no cost to you. Just like anything with the VA, this process takes time, there are a few steps, and there is paperwork. But there are some pretty incredible pieces of equipment out there...they're just expensive.

I am sitting here this morning. I should be at work as I have no leave left but I cannot even walk much past the car out in the driveway. I don't know what I am supposed to do but I do not want to give up on our sport. I cannot hunt anymore, no more hikes. Just a few miles from the the Appalachian Trail runs across the southeast corner of our county. I would love to be able to walk it again but that won's happen in the near future.

Good point about casting being technique. My mom is all of 5' tall but you should see her cast a fly. She is in her 70's and suffering from macular degeneration. Her sight is all but gone as are her days of hunting and fishing. Wish I was near a fluid with the rod or rifle as she is. When I was a kid I used to think it was funny that mom never came home with an empty creel or game bag where as sometimes the men would.

My infirmities are not service related. Well at least they were not service caused thought I suppose the case could be made that the Army accepted me with a known diseases even back then. Even back then my arthritis showed up during a routine X-ray for an injury. I had to sign a waver just so I could finish my tour as an Aviator. I don't know if the VA can help but they have more deserving vets than me on the waiting list right now.

[Lotech]

If you served, you deserve. You spent years of your life serving this country. Now it's time for this country to serve you. You earned it, it's your right, you deserve it. If the VA balks, call your congressman. Your loyalty to this country and your love for your fellow veterans means too much for me to be polite. Yes, the VA is busy. Yes, today's vets are deserving. But, you were first in line. NEVER GIVE UP.

[flyguy66]

You would be amazed what would happen if you went to get in that line you mentioned. Those new vets...some missing limbs and some in wheelchairs...would make sure you got in line in front of them if they knew you were a "new guy" or a Vietnam-era vet, etc. They're very good about looking out for each other and have an immense respect for "old warriors." By and large they are an amazing bunch of young men and women. And they'd be the first to tell you to get to the VA...and they don't mind the extra wait. So much for that idea.

You should also know that service-connectedness is no longer defined as "caused by service in the armed forces," but as "caused or aggravated by..." This change came several years ago and is retroactive. Another thing you should know is that your type of conditions are among the most common injuries young troops...troops in their 20s...are being medically discharged for today. Riding in mine-resistant vehicles and living in 100 lbs of body armor and combat gear most of their lives for the past 10 years has crippled an entire generation of our Army and Marine Corps. Unbelievable numbers of them have degenerative disk disease and osteoarthritis of the spine, neck, and knees...while still in their 20s! So the understanding of what causes and aggravates (triggers early onset) these orthopedic disabilities at the VA has advanced by light years in the past decade. So has their ability to treat them. On the other hand, they're still the VA. It's still all about exhausting their impulse to deny things and say no to stuff and make excuses for not doing what they're supposed to do before it works the way it is supposed to work. It is still all about them trying to figure out how to get you to go away and you making them realize that you aren't going away until they do the right thing. It's one of the worst bureaucracies in the whole federal government. But it beats having no healthcare and no benefits by a LONG shot! And sitting in the waiting room with some other vets I have actually met some pretty good fishing buddies.