Good enough....

[jsmartt]

When I was young I fished with low cost gear because that was what i could afford. I fished a lot and caught a lot and gained a lot of fishing knowledge. Now that I'm an old **** I have more expensive gear. I use waders instead of cutoffs and tennis shoes, I have a nice Orvis T3 rod (second hand) and a good reel, lots of flies etc. Dose the better equipment make me a better fisher? Well it may help me a bit, but the knowledge that comes from being a fisherman for over 50 years helps me the most. That said I do enjoy having decent equipment. At this point in my life I can afford it and take pleasure in using good equipment. But even if i still could afford only bottom end equipment I would still be out fishing. I have a work acquaintence that is a fly fishermen. He is always bringing in beautiful bamboo rods and expensive reels etc. which are indeed works of art and to him the collecting of this equipment seems to bring more pleasure than actually fishing with it. We live in an area with excellent trout fishing all year, and yet he only goes out rarely. For me the joy of fishing is the time on the water, the beautiful scenery, the solitude, and the anticipation of the next bite.

[Buddy Sanders]

Duckster,

Me too.

As far as tackle goes, though....

The purchase of any non esential item is always about choice. It is up to us.

But, how do we weigh in the effect of the advertising and the 'hype' as it were? The 'pressure', whether obvious or subtle placed on us all by this marketing style?

A lot of this is all interconnected. The fly rod companies spend money to 'advertise' their products in print. The places where rods are sold are given incentives to sell 'high end' rods (larger mark ups, cost savings on larger orders, etc.) which make the guy in the shop want to sell a certain rod brand. The guides are given 'special deals' on rods so that their customers see and use the rods. This leads to a perception that such rods are 'the' rods to have.

Nothing 'bad' about this, but think it through a bit, and you'll see that it limits what we have available. The battle the major rod companies are winning is NOT technological. They are winning the battle for shelf space. If it's what is there, it's what you buy. You can't buy a rod you don't see on the rack.

No where was this more evident than the fly tying hook market. For many, many years, the Mustad standard fly hooks were exactly that, the 'standard' for the vast majority of anglers. A good hook at a fair price.

But, something happened. A 'better' hook came along. Really? You started hearing that Mustad was poor quality (several fly shops told me this). That their hook would break, or bend, or they would rust, etc.. Did Mustad change how they made hooks? Did they drop all QC testing? What hapened?

Of course, the shops where this was said didn't have any Mustad hooks, only other supposedly 'better' brands.

Ask yourself this. How many of you have a fly shop near you where you can (or could in the last five years) go in and have as full a selection of Mustad 'classic' hooks as they have of the other hooks?

Did Mustad stop making 'good' hooks, or did they sucumb to a well planned blitkrieg of advertising hype executed by an off shore hook manyfacturer? I know that all of a sudden, all the magazine articles, all the TV anglers, all the 'high profile' types were hyping these more expensive 'better' hooks.

Now, of course, you no longer have a 'choice'. Mustad has changed to try to 'compete'. But, did they really EVER try to compete? It seemed to me that in the last twenty years, if I wanted Mustad classic fly hooks, I had to get them via mail order. If you walked into a fly shop, all you had was Tiemco, Daichii, maybe Gamagatsu if you were near the ocean. The casual fly tyer will just buy whats there.

Why was Mustad not even THERE? Did the fly shops make more money on the other hooks? Probably. Was there a 'physical marketing' issue with Mustad, something to do with ease of sale, packaging, etc.? Don't know.

I do know, though, that if you can't get your product into the same stores, you aren't 'competing', you are giving up. Could the issue have been a bit of hubris? I don't know.

I do know that Mustad 'classic' hooks were 'good enough' for me. I actually preferred them over the other brands, and not just because of price.

Shelf space. Just like soup, canned corn, or cereal.

Buddy

[DaveP63]

I agree with the sentement, but I would add that if it weren't for the trend towards constant improvement (from the manufacturers) and the need for the latest and greatest (from the consumers), I would have far less expensive (abeit used) rods in my collection. I also applaud the fact that the improvements have most definately made their way to the lower end of the rod market, and I for one, am thankful! The low end rod that I bought ten years ago is a complete stick compared to the low end Redington that I got early this year. It was quite a revelation and that started my process of picking up some of the latest, greatest used tackle that I could afford to get! Otherwise I'd still be using a ten year old Cabelas outfit...

[Gigmaster]

I still own and fish with both a bamboo, and fiberglass rod. There is nothing wrong with either material. Do they cast like a graphite? Probably not, but there are times when I prefer the slower action of fiberglass, and the 'live' feel of bamboo. I own graphites as well, although they are the lower-end Scientific Anglers models. But they do the job, and do it well.

I have some of the 'new' Mustad hooks, and if I don't look at the package, I can't tell the difference between the old and new ones. And you still have to sharpen the 'laser-sharp' new hooks. None of them come sharp enough from the factory, not even Gamakatsus.

It's the same with traditional tackle. In Wal-Mart the other day, I couldn't believe what I saw. There is a new 'kid' rod out now that actually SHOOTS specially made sabot-type fishing lures and set ups, off the end of the rod, like an airgun. Was this really necesary? Could this mess them up for real fishing?

Most fishing tackle is made to catch FISHERMAN, rather than fish. I wouldn't hesitate for a second to buy a new fiberglass rod if any were still avaliable.

And I still fish with canes poles, on occasion ($3.99, fully rigged, at Wal-Mart. Just add worms)...........

[Crotalus]

Every piece of old, ancient and archaic technology was "new and improved" at one time.

if you stop to think about it more than likely many moons ago two guys fishing with thier greenheart rods and horse hair lines were walking home discussing these new fangled split bamboo rods and silk lines and trying to figure when it was gonna end


When the first Indianapolis 500 was run those cars were the cutting edge of technology of the time, and guys were probably sitting around wondering when someone was going to break "x"mph speed barrier or if it ever would be broken. now nearly every car on the road today could probably have won the first 500

any "current" era is the culmination of the previous eras and the starting point for the next era. Who knows 20 years from now guys may be discussing the latest "moon dust infused poly organic" rods that can cast 200' and why the rod manufacturers are continuing to develop "new and improved" rods when they are "good enough"

I'll close by asking one last question "what if the guys using greenheart rods and horse hair had decided they were "good enough" and no other rods were ever developed?

[TyroneFly]

I'll close by asking one last question "what if the guys using greenheart rods and horse hair had decided they were "good enough" and no other rods were ever developed?

History has shown that good enough is never good enough. Someone will always come along claiming they built a better mousetrap.

[jeffnles1]

I tend to agree with most of what has been said so far.

I would like to add a comment about the tippet.

Why would we need 6X or 7X fluro tippet when the heavier stuff is invisible? My answer is has anyone tried to get 3X tippet through the eye of as size 20 or smaller hook?

As for advances in line technology, well, I've had fish break off before and I'm sure I'll have them break off again regardless of the technology. That's just part of the game.

If someone were to invent a line that would never break regardless of the knot tied or the line diameter I somehow think that would take some of the anticipation out of hooking a big fish. Part of the fun is the knowledge that you're pushing the line to the limits and the anticipation of if it'll hold or not. That balance between fighting the fish to the net or hand and not wanting to wear it out to the point it cannot survive after release.

I've only bought one full retail price new rod in my life (Winston B2-t). The others I have have either been close outs or purchased second hand at substantial savings.

Hooks - I don't think I've ever lost a fish because of a bad hook.

Reels - well, I am a fan of good machining but don't feel the need to run out and replace my reels every year. I buy good ones and use them until they wear out (never happened yet) or I break them (not happened yet with fly reels yet).

Vests and packs - use them until they wear out and then replace.

I'm not a skin flint or cheap, I just buy what I like and am then satisfied with my purchase.

I have bought enough feathers, thread and other assorted fly tying stuff that my wife thinks I should be part owner of several fly shops.

Jeff

[rnelson]

I certainly can't afford to buy most of the newer models of rods. But what I do like is the huge sales that manufacturers have on the old models. Just got an Orvis flyer in the mail today and they have some of their $600 rods at about half price.

I guess one could ask why they were $600 in the first place if they can sell them now for half of that. But, it is the American way.

Rick

[Gemrod]

How does anybody know what color a fish can see? To the human spectrum or scientific if you want to go there.....red is the first color that disappears in water....to US. Too a fish...who knows? If this is so why is red on a fly one of the, if not THE most successful color to put on a fly. Or at least seems to be the most successful color to me. Why can a fish see a BLACK fly 20' down and take it? Not much light down there.......but they do it.

Gemrod

[tailingloop]

Gemrod,

There have been a number of studies that have determined what different species of fish can see in terms of color, including areas of the spectrum not visible to humans. A couple of books have been published and the studies and books describe the methodologies for testing. Black is very effective in low light not because it can be seen, but because it stands out against the little light that may be available, kind of like a black hole. Ocean pelagic fish like bill fish don't see many colors that shallow water fish may, such as pinks and reds. Some fish, like trout see uv wavelengths. Red is an effective attractor color for many species. The red end if the spectrum is attenuated before the blue end as you go deeper in the water column. Go deep enough and there is no red light to reflect so something that looks red above water looks black deep and thus has the same effect as a black object in low light.


As for how good is enough - that all depends.


I have a couple of Pflueger Medalist reels and they are fine for many things around here like bass and panfish but not good choices for fishing the bays and surfzone. I have several Orvis Battenkill Disc reels that are great for most freshwater fishing and most local inshore species, but not suitable for yellowfin tuna or too many large bonito where somthing like a Tibor, Abel, TFO Terry Hayden, Mako, etc is a much better choice. Similar comparisons may be made for rods. I have 4 10wt rods but 2 are clearly better tools for vertical slugfests with ocean critters. I have 3 12wts and one is clearly superior for big fish in vertical fights like with tuna but the other two are more than enough for big fish in shallow water like tarpon.

I have reels than range in retail prices from $20 to $850 and rods from $25 to $700 and more often than not the less expensive ones are plenty good enough (the top end stuff was all acquired at least 40% below retail). The more expensive stuff is typically more pleasant to use. The most expensive stuff is sometimes the best tool for the job at hand.