FLY CASTING VS FLY FISHING
Neil talks about the difference between casting and fishing, and why being good at one does not necessarily mean being good at the other.
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FLY CASTING VS FLY FISHING
Neil talks about the difference between casting and fishing, and why being good at one does not necessarily mean being good at the other.
Nice article, Neil.
Nothing brings you back down to Earth about teaching fly casting like teaching the disabled and kids. They are singular in their objective: let's get this stuff down quickly so we can go catch fish! It also constantly reminds you to keep your "stuff" boiled down to its simplest form. And to stay student-focused, instead of falling victim to the drift into process focus or self-absorbtion that so often turn good coaches into bad ones.
I have a pretty strong grasp of physics, biomechanics, kinesiology, and such. But few things bore me quite so quickly as a passionate debate about what makes a triangular point on a forward cast, or how much "delayed rotation" should be applied to the "perfect" double-haul.
But I can really get into a good discussion about where the biggest trout hang out in the river, or fluorocarbon vs. nylon mono tippet: does it matter! I can listen for hours to salty dog fly fishermen discussing their flats tactics.
So I really enjoyed reading your perspective on the proper place of fly casting in the grand scheme of the cosmos this morning.
?Fly casting is nothing more than getting the fly from where you are to where the fish are. If you can do that consistently you are a successful fly caster."
Made my day! Maybe I am a successful caster, ugly as they are.
Thanks,
Rick
Now I really enjoyed this article. I am not one to sit through and read articles online, not much a big reader, but I found this one to be so true.
When I first decided to start fly fishing, a couple of years ago, I was so hung up on getting a long distance and not technique and presentation. Then realized getting the distance wasn't catching any fish. I had to concentrate on my presentation and other casting techniques to be successful.
Once I started to learn the more finesse aspect of fly fishing, getting to the fish, then presenting the fly in the proper manner, my catch rate started to really improve big time! :)
Thanks for the very enlightening article, I enjoyed it.
Mike
"Fly casting is nothing more than getting the fly from where you are to where the fish are. If you can do that consistently you are a successful fly caster!"
Dee ... I think I love your husband!!:cool:
I really enjoyed the article. It got me to thinking about the whole picture of fly fishing/casting. When I gave up the tournament bass fishing thing, after 30 years, I picked up a fly rod and went to the river where I found my love for fishing again. I have always fished for as long as I can remember and I really enjoy getting away from the "world" and just fish. Tournament fishing took the "joy" and "fun" out of my fishing and the crowded lakes took my desire to fish away. It seemed like all I ever did was "hunt" for bass and see what pattern they were on so that I could do well in the next tournament. When I sold my bass boat my wife told me that I would go crazy if I did not do some sort of fishing and a friend of mine told me to go buy a fly rod and go to the river. I bought a Wal-Mart special and a handful of flies and went to the river. Never casted a fly rod in my life and was not the least bit worried about that. I just wanted to go fishing and enjoy the day. After getting away from everyone, so I would not be the entertainment for everyone who knew what they were doing, I started playing with the fly rod to see what it wanted me to do so that I could get the store bought flies where I wanted them. I started off with a grasshopper fly and by the end of the day, I had caught my limit and was a happy fisherman. From that day to now, I never give casting a second thought ( and my casting shows it!). I just fish and I can get the flies to go where I want them and can mend line as needed and seem to do everything well enough to catch fish and that is my main goal. Now I tie my own flies, teach the basic techniques of fly tying in classes and have met some great fly fishermen/ladies while fishing and tying. Fly fishing is a wonderful and relaxing sport and I love it. I just noticed that I am rambling and that was not my intentions and I apologize.
My main thought after reading this article is that maybe we need to take new comers to this sport fishing first and casting second. Once they see the importance of better casting, it will give them the desire to learn better casting. I have met and talked to so many people who said they have thought about taking up fly fishing, but, did not think they could get the "hang" of the casting. So many people feel you do a lot of casting with fly fishing and this is caused by all the videos they watch and see a lot of "rod waving" while fishing. No one explains to them why that particular video shows a lot of false casting because the person is dry fly fishing and is removing the water from the fly so it will float better. Once I explain that, it seems to make better sense to them. I honestly feel that we need to take the new person to a pond somewhere and just turn them lose. Let them figure out what they need to do with the rod to get the fly where they want it. Let them come to you and ask how you are able to put the fly where you want it easier than they can which results in more fish caught. When they have the desire to learn better casting to improve their "catching", they will be better students and learn faster because they want to get back to fishing with a fly rod.
Sorry for the long post....
I agree wholeheartedly with the article. I teach fly casting and my philosophy is to give students a solid foundation upon which they can build. I tell them that if they can get the fly from Point A to Point B and it results in a hookup, then everything is good.
I had two students several years ago who want to learn how to cast. One was a local real estate mogul and the other was her boyfriend. Neither was much of an angler with any tackle. I asked them why the sudden interest in fly casting. "We're going to the Keys next week to fly fish for bonefish," one said matter of factly.
Hmmmm. Good luck, I thought.
There's a distinc dfiference between fly casting and fly fishing. Of course, you have to learn how to deliver the fly before you can begin fishing. But I've seen some great casters who were clueless when it came to fishing. Fly fishing is a whole nother world.
I get quite a few anglers from around the country who tell me they've been fly fishing all their life. But when we go out, they have a very difficult time mustering 25 or 30 feet. Most don't have the necessary skills to succeed. Add wind and it's almost impossible.
I don't care how they cast -- if they can put the fly where it needs to be. Reminds me of a time years ago when I showed up at the golf course and they paired me with an old guy. I watched his hideous swing and figured I'd win some money. It was one of the worst swings I've ever seen. But when the clubhead met the ball, it was square. And he hit it long and straight down the middle. I got my clock cleaned by a guy with a terrible swing.
I always tell me students that success is directly proportional to the amount of time, effort and interest they put into the endeavor. If they want to succeed, they probably will.
"I can double haul, but I rarely do. I still drop my back cast occasionally, tail my loops, tie neat knots in my leaders while casting, and all those other casting no no’s that cause casting instructors to develop gray hair, but somehow I manage to catch my share of the fish and have a heck of a good time doing it. At the end of the day I think that’s what fly fishing is all about."
Couldn't agree more.
Although we all strive to improve, in the end, if you have a fish at hand, you've done something right.
But - gak ! ...... sounded like you were describing my casting ..... (ok, I'm still on a frequent basis with casting knots, and dropped backcasts)
Very well said, sir. You inspired some memories, for which I thank you.
My dear old Grandpa was an extraordinary fly fisherman. His casting skills were functionally very practical but not fancy and he caught fish more than anyone I've since met because he knew trout, and trout water. Any time I was there to watch I don't believe I ever saw him cast more than 20 or 30 feet. He was gifted in that his job allowed him quite a range of travel and his car was never absent his fly rod. He was able, after a quick bout of business, to spend hours fishing his way back to the house, or the hotel, and all of eastern Idaho and western Montana were his playground. He particularly loved the Madison River.
I miss him dearly.
Yep.
That's why I don't put too much stock in the details.
If you can manage to catch a fish or two, that was the purpose to picking up the rod. The rest is just so much fluff.
I really don't go catching, but I do love to go fishing. ;)
Mostly I love to help others catch fish.
I am one of the worst casters, but I can catch fish (not a master by any means, but I can pull fish out of the water).
I put zero effort into casting, and always feel bad about that lol
Dont feel bad solo. Bout the only kind of casting i'm good at is pulling my 3 fly nymph rigs out of the water and lobbing them 15 feet upstream. As you can imagine i'm not a very good dry fly fisherman. I just throw em out there and hope i'm lucky.
I mostly agree with the article that casting and fishing are two separate but related skills; but in all fairness, Steve and Jeff Rajeff are fantastic fly fishers. They won the first Fly Fishing Masters contest on OLN TV that had competitors from all sections of the USA, many of whom were guides.
I would say that on balance the fantastic caster that is a poor fisher is an anomaly in our sport. Most good casters are also good fishers and the skill of casting and fishing pretty much match.
What makes the article so engaging is that it points out the anomaly of a good caster who is a poor fisher. But that is not an excuse to ignore casting as an important part of our sport.
My second point is that with the advent of strike indicator lob and drift fishing, you can be a relatively poor caster and still catch fish. If catching fish were the only object of fishing, very few of us would be fly fishers. I believe fly fishing transcends just catching fish. Much of that is the beauty and skill of fly casting. I enjoy watching a skillful fly fisher and caster work the water with pinpoint casts. I really don't enjoy watching someone lobbing a short line strike indicator rig.
But that is just me.
Well said, Silver Creek! I agree. I'll stop dead in my tracks to watch a fly caster who looks like he knows what he's doing. He doesn't even have to be catching a fish.
Some fly cast-right handed, others fly cast left-handed, to really master fly casting learn to become a ambidextrous fly caster. Being proficient with both your right and left arm and hand.
Practice on an open public playing field, with Frisbees scattered at various distance down wind.
Build-up muscle memory in both arms and hands, until you can cast without thinking about the cast. It helps to keep track of your percentages for each target, to monitor your improvement.
You will learn your natural range for accuracy (90% or higher) and at what distance your accuracy falls off at.
On really windy days you can scatter the targets in a wheel formation around your casting position and cast with the wind in all quarters. Again building muscle memory in both arms in hands.
Practice casting to "Lawn Targets" will increase your effectiveness casting on the water, causing you to enjoy fly fishing more and thinking about the cast less! ~Parnelli
PS: If you normally fish sitting down normally (tubes or drift boats) bring a stool and practice sitting down).
I've never seriously tried off hand casting. I am sooo right hand dominant. I know I should try to learn because I can't fish the right side of a river as well as I can the left side. Being a lefty is an advantage in fly fishing.
Speaking of off hand casting, Jerry Seim, the rod designer for Sage casts every new rod design with his left (off) hand to simulate how the new rods would feel in a beginner's hand. He uses that to tweek his rod design to perform well for beginners as well as experts. I thought that was an inventive way for a very good caster to test his rods.
Guys, the reason I fly fish is to relax. it's not even the act of fishing but more the act of getting out there and think of absolutely nothing. If I had to start to practice my casting be that range, accuracy, tight loops etc it would become too much like work and I would not do it. My casting is horrible, my flies look even worse. But since catching the fish is only a bonus I still enjoy what I do and quite frankly I do not care how good or bad fly fisher I am. If you gotten onto this activity (fishing is not a sport) to become good caster then by all means practice casting but to most people I fish with "the style" so to speak is quite unimportant. Last dude that made a comment about my bad casting got outfished and laughed at...:)
I like Neil's article very much because it brings the High And Mighty Fly Fishing to the level of normal everyday folks...
I found Neil's article was a breath of fresh air. I to teach fly casting along with fly fishing, and fly tying. I had the experience of being a good caster and poor fly angler.
Back when I was introduced to the sport in 1970, I was taught much about casting and very little about actually fly fishing. As a consequence I became a good caster but became increasingly frustrated with my low catch ratio. After a while I gave up fly fishing and went back to pulling plugs. Then in 1986 while fishing a Cariboo Lake I witnessed rainbows feeding on scuds in the shallows. This led me to question why my fly fishing mentors had not told me about the proper use of flies. This got me reading books on the subject. The more I studied the better my catch ratio became.
The self taught road was a long one, but I learned and got into instructing and writing on the subject in the mid 90s. Now I teach my students that fly casting while being a very effective way to present a fly, it is not fly fishing.
I also agree with you Silver Creek. There is far too much emphisis put on distance, when learning to cast effectively with both hands would serve an angler much better. When I teach intermediate fly casting; I get my students to work on casting while sitting on a bucket, on one knee, and sitting flat on the ground, with both right and left hands.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wgflyer
I strongly suspect that one of the primary reasons he was an extraordinary fisherman is exactly because he never cast more than 20 or 30 feet. The further you cast, the more of your line is on the water where it will be subject to varying currents, so getting a good presentation becomes harder and harder with increased casting distance. Reading the water and the "microcurrents" is hard enough at 20 feet. I think it is impossible at 60.
I'm sure it depends on where you fish, but I strongly believe that practice in stealthy wading and good presentation will pay more dividends than practice in distance casting. I fish with a tenkara rod, so casting much beyond 20 feet is out of the question. The presentation is much better, though, and I catch a lot more fish than I did when I could cast further.
My attitude is more like Mikie's I think. I like to consider myself a fairly proficient fly fisher (others with whom I have associated may disagree), and while I can throw a fly around, I will never claim to be an expert caster. I put the flies where I want, when I want, most of the time, but suffer all of the normal difficulties in doing so. But when someone comes up to me and says "You need to [insert corrective action] to improve your casting", I get riled. If I wanted to be a competition fly caster, I would be out in the yard right now practicing. I know there are "flaws" in my casting, and I know that, given sufficient hard work, I could "correct" them. But that is not why I cast. I cast because you need to do it to get the fly to the fish, and that is the ONLY reason. And I HAVE seen more than a few people who were beautiful casters, who had no grasp at all of the skills to turn that into successfully bringing fish to hand.
Each of us has his or her own reasons for partaking of this sport, or the parts thereof. Casting, tying, fishing, etc. I feel it is inappropriate for people to say that to be successful at any of it, you "should" be able to do certain things. THERE ARE NO RULES, THERE ARE NO STANDARDS! Sheesh. If you are enjoying yourself, you are doing everything you need to be doing.
PS. Ugly flies catch more fish!
Cookie
I spend most of my time fishing a large, fairly fast very popular river in Michigan. Probably the most common cause I see when people aren't catching fish is that they are fishing way too long a line. There is no way you can control your fly presentation with a mile of line out (at least not on my home river).
My wife is a very casual fisher, she likes to be on the river, and fishing is a good excuse to be out. When you watch her fish, you can tell her casting skills are minimal, but she does catch fish. It interesting to watch people, you can see folks who can easily cast twice as far as my wife, yet they still may be fishless while in the same time period, my wife has caught 10 or 15 fish.
To be honest, I had the same problem when I first started fishing my home river 30 years ago, I was an experienced fly fisher at the time, but I caught very few fish. I often fished with my brother or other friends, who were at least catching a few fish while I often caught none. It wasn't until I realized I needed to concentrate on fishing, rather than long distance casting, did I start catching fish.
For me fly fishing is about relaxing and enjoying the moment. Its not about how well I cast or how many fish I catch. There are days I cast well, fell like I'm at the top of my game and cath nothing. I consider that good day. There are days I catch many fish and stop because its repetitive and becomes boring. Other days I find that one fish and consider the hunt a sucessful day of fun.
I've fished with many people here and caught zero or one fish and still carry those wonderful memories fresh in my mind. Dave Micus, Josko, Flats, Chris (and others) hopefully share those memories and don't consider the count important.
I also remember the day I fished the Cold river. Caught nothing, saw nothing and had such a great time concentrating on placing my 20 and 30 foot casts that I went back and repeated the experience.
jed
I think it goes without saying that the more proficient an angler one is at ALL of the skill sets associated with fly fishing, the more enjoyment potential lies within one's reach. What some seem to lose sight of is that casting is but ONE of those skill sets. And I think that is what Neil's article was really about. Of course, only Neil could tell us that for certain. ;)
For example, I don't think it is a hard rule that the more line one has beyond the rod tip the less effective of a presentation one has. While I think this is a generally true principle for the dry fly or nymph fisherman, it is not true for the streamer, deep stillwater, or popping bug fisherman. Fishing to a target suspended 15' deep is going to require you to put some line in the water to get any presentation at all.
Having a strong double-haul that you can cast accurately and effortlessly to 60-75 feet in good conditions will give you the ability to cast effectively to 40 feet in a wind that would stop many fly anglers of lesser casting skill.
But mending skills, knot skills, fish playing skills, stalking and wading skills, boating skills, and a whole bunch of other stuff can be just as important to how much frustration one can avoid and fun one can have. And even with quite meager skills, one can have a lifetime of fun in fly fishing.
Being a good caster never hinders your fishing. One cannot say the same about being a poor caster. For me, that is the bottom line.