Economical Premium Reel Advice

I know the title sounds like a contradiction, but here it goes:
I just came back from a great day in the catskills where I had fish hammering my dries all day (thanks to a wonderful guide, since the day before on my own I had a few short strikes on a nymph and not much else).
Anyway, those fish included two photo-worthy "trophy" type fish (one brown and one rainbow). This is a big river with strong wild fish only so it was quite a battle.
I had what I thought was a good set-up, a sage vantage rod (an example of what I call "Economical Premium") and a ross flycast reel.
Long story short, the big brown fought like crazy (longest fish fight of my life ending with me falling out of the drift boat :(, losing my cigar but keeping the fish!). Any, this fish took my boat downstream about 60 yards and went pretty close to my backing and the reel was a disaster, the drag was jerky and the spool was wobbely. The big 'bow was only a little worse. Hence, it is time to pony up for a good reel, large arbor, 4 or 5 weight that will not break the brank (i.e. no insance ross or hatch reals that cost more than my first car.
Thanks as always for your advice.

I like the Teton Tiogas. You can get a lot of reels on e-bay that are barely used for good prices. Lamson Konics are very popular, but I haven't tried one.

Difficult to know what you mean by "economical". What is your price range? What sort of reel are you replacing? What you want from the sounds of it is a good disk drag based reel. There are a lot of them on the market. From Echo, to Ross, to Orvis, the price range is $80-150 or thereabouts.

Oh and be forewarned you'll get a bunch "you don't need a drag on a trout reel" responses, and these can be ignored. Obviously you've already found a need for a drag. Good luck.

you might look at Allen fly fishing

Lots of used reels out there too.

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Originally Posted by whatfly

Difficult to know what you mean by "economical". What is your price range? What sort of reel are you replacing? What you want from the sounds of it is a good disk drag based reel. There are a lot of them on the market. From Echo, to Ross, to Orvis, the price range is $80-150 or thereabouts.

Oh and be forewarned you'll get a bunch "you don't need a drag on a trout reel" responses, and these can be ignored. Obviously you've already found a need for a drag. Good luck.

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That's what I thought too for years, my small stream reel is a vintage eagle claw, but there is no question I need good drag, the first fish I caught i instinctively palmed the reel and lost the fish instantly.
Economical is the minimum I can spend while getting a solid reliable reel that can handle a big fish on a big river. The Ross Flystart obviously wasnt that reel.

The FlyLogic FLP is a winner. You might find a Hardy either side of a hundred bucks. I have and they are great reels. Talking about the small sized Marquis or System (SciANglers), and the LRH.

For the money the Echo is probably the best bet in a new reel.

All current Lamsons have the same guts... and they are very good guts.

They would be my top two choices.

I have smoked a TON of reels on big fish. I have a lot of different brands and have used about every brand out there. I have somewhere around 35 Hardy reels, for example.

Ross is a brand I simply refuse to use again, for anything. Their old models are far better than their new, but only "good".

SA, Hardy-made Orvis, and SA-made Orvis are good for the money. The SA is really heavy for the size, IME.

Sage reels are not up to the level of their rods... I use several of them, but not where big fish are possible.

Hap, have you had any experience with the Allen reels?

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Originally Posted by hap

For the money the Echo is probably the best bet in a new reel.

All current Lamsons have the same guts... and they are very good guts.

They would be my top two choices.

I have smoked a TON of reels on big fish. I have a lot of different brands and have used about every brand out there. I have somewhere around 35 Hardy reels, for example.

Ross is a brand I simply refuse to use again, for anything. Their old models are far better than their new, but only "good".

SA, Hardy-made Orvis, and SA-made Orvis are good for the money. The SA is really heavy for the size, IME.

Sage reels are not up to the level of their rods... I use several of them, but not where big fish are possible.

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Echo seems like a similar rod to the Ross Flystart/cast premium type components in a cheaper reel.
I am very intrigued by the Allen.
The mid-line orvis are mid-arbor and I would like a large arbor.
So here are my choices (minus a newcomer):
Allen Trout
Lamson Konic
Lamson Guru (if I can find one on sale still)
Hardy Ultralite CLS (I know its 100 more but the money saved with cassettes v. spools seems to make up for that very very quickly).
Any comments on these or an additional runner. Based on what I am hearing I would like: Bulletproof, big fish fighting drag reliability, sub-200 and large arbor.

I have seen Echos used extensively on very big fish... The best Ross IMO&E does not come close. let alone the FlyStart. I have seen the Ross Vexsis fail repeatedly, brand new out of the box...

The Allen is not a brand I have any experience with, so I cannot offer anything there.

The local fly shop I hang out in has been selling a bunch of Echos to salmon and large-trout fishermen for quite a while and they have been virtually issue-free.

These days when I buy a reel for myself it is a Lamson... so I consider them a great choice.

I friend just bought a huge Hardy today for tropical saltwater use and it looks like a tremendous reel for the money...

No question in my mind.....go for the Lamson. Worth every penny !!!

Echo Ion is a reasonable reel, but it only comes with a 1 year warranty, which I'm not that crazy about, but the price point is good. Allen is a newcomer and while some like it, I've yet to meet anyone who has really tested one against largish fish. The Orvis Mid Arbor is a relatively affordable disk drag, and for me has been reliable on larger fish (steelhead). Lamsons are nice but they are slow to pick up line (i.e. when in a drift boat) so I tend to avoid them although I still use my 1st gen Velocity for Lahontans in the 28"+ range, steelhead, and stripers.

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Originally Posted by whatfly

Echo Ion is a reasonable reel, but it only comes with a 1 year warranty, which I'm not that crazy about, but the price point is good. Allen is a newcomer and while some like it, I've yet to meet anyone who has really tested one against largish fish. The Orvis Mid Arbor is a relatively affordable disk drag, and for me has been reliable on larger fish (steelhead). Lamsons are nice but they are slow to pick up line (i.e. when in a drift boat) so I tend to avoid them although I still use my 1st gen Velocity for Lahontans in the 28"+ range, steelhead, and stripers.

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Wow, thanks, so what would you recommend?

Redington Rise is a pretty solid reel not mentioned here yet.

Not sure what Hap's issue with Sage reels is but I have used an 1800 series reel for Stripers and Bonito, and a Bonito will peel line off faster than any trout ever will, without issue.

I bought an Allen reel and was disappointed, but I guess I shouldn't have expected more for the price. There were numerous flaws in the machining (obvious machining marks and actual gouges in the surface) and in the finish. Rather than pay postage to send it back I stuck in on one of my bass rods. The one-way roller bearing also appeared to be of a lower quality type. Drag resistance seems to be ok. But really, the quality issues with the frame would leave me wondering about possible issues with the drag mechanism.

We have sold a lot of TFO prism reels and not had anyone complain of any issues. One of my angling buddies has been using Prisms in saltwater for three years now without an issue.

The Okuma Helios is very solid too.

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Originally Posted by farleycat

No question in my mind.....go for the Lamson. Worth every penny !!!

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what he said. i have both the konic and the guru. the konic is cast, the guru machined i believe. if i were to choose between the two, i'd say get the guru. same drag as the konic, but i think being machined it will be more durable. you can also find some really nice used reels if you scour the classifieds on the various forums. galvans pop up fairly regularly and they are fantastic reels. can't vouch for the seller, but if i had the cash and needed another 5/6 reel i'd snap this one up: http://www.washingtonflyfishing.com/...wt-reel.88821/.

Most of my fly reels are Orvis made in England. I recently purchased a Trout 2 from Allen Fly Fishing for my 5wt. I am very impressed with the quality. I would definitley check them out.

allenflyfishing.com

Dave

Get a Lamson and don't look back. And, we need pics of the falling out of the boat episode for rating purposes.

I found some Ross Rhythm reels on clearance a few years back...great reels with solid drags. There are other discontinued Ross reels on clearance if you search the web. Buy Ross...made in Colo, USA.

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Originally Posted by tailingloop

Not sure what Hap's issue with Sage reels is but I have used an 1800 series reel for Stripers and Bonito, and a Bonito will peel line off faster than any trout ever will, without issue.

I bought an Allen reel and was disappointed, but I guess I shouldn't have expected more for the price. There were numerous flaws in the machining (obvious machining marks and actual gouges in the surface) and in the finish. Rather than pay postage to send it back I stuck in on one of my bass rods. The one-way roller bearing also appeared to be of a lower quality type. Drag resistance seems to be ok. But really, the quality issues with the frame would leave me wondering about possible issues with the drag mechanism.

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The problem I have with the Sage reel is the fact they cost as much as they do for what you get... They are priced roughly with their rods and are not in the same class. They are not bad reels, I have and use several of them. For the same money I can find a large number of reels I think perform better.

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Originally Posted by whatfly

Echo Ion is a reasonable reel, but it only comes with a 1 year warranty, which I'm not that crazy about, but the price point is good. Allen is a newcomer and while some like it, I've yet to meet anyone who has really tested one against largish fish. The Orvis Mid Arbor is a relatively affordable disk drag, and for me has been reliable on larger fish (steelhead). Lamsons are nice but they are slow to pick up line (i.e. when in a drift boat) so I tend to avoid them although I still use my 1st gen Velocity for Lahontans in the 28"+ range, steelhead, and stripers.

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Echo Ion has just a one year warranty... but no one I know has needed to use it... The Ross FlyStart has a lifetime warranty and they will honor it... But all you will get is another FlyStart. If the Ions are being used for really large trout and salmon on the Kenai River without issue (they are) I guarantee they will work better than any Ross.

I would take an Ion without a warranty after seeing their proven perfomance here if money is the central issue.

I have zero vested interest in Echo and do not stand to benefit in any way from the company.

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Originally Posted by bluegill

I found some Ross Rhythm reels on clearance a few years back...great reels with solid drags. There are other discontinued Ross reels on clearance if you search the web. Buy Ross...made in Colo, USA.

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Those clearance models have huge issues with the drag systems. The mechanism to change from LH to RH wind is a simple dial/lever inside the frame. Under pressure the drag components will stick very slightly. When you start to reel in the sticky drag surfaces may stay together just long enough to disengage the drag completely. Suddenly you have a large fish and absolutely no drag.

Ross should not be selling those reels at any price...

So, reading the posts from just the first page alone there are over a dozen recommendations. I stopped there. Does that tell you anything?

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Originally Posted by Allan

So, reading the posts from just the first page alone there are over a dozen recommendations. I stopped there. Does that tell you anything?

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Yes, that there are a lot of great reels at any price point and everyone has a favorite.
I think I am going to go with an orvis, they've never steered me wrong and i just picked up one of their clearwater 10 footers, for the price I don't think anything compares.
The lamson was the most recommended but also the most maligned, some research there appears to be some complaints about it.
All the other companies have only sporadic recommendations/complaint (i.e. allen, okuma, redington, tfo etc). Ross is out since the ross I had was a bust.
Other option is hardy.
I am also trying to decide if the orvis clearwater reel is a good choice (although noone has mentioned it)

I know this may be a bit late but consider the Nautilus FWX reels. Made in the USA, super HD drag and very well made (machined), Lifetime Warranty. They are a bit more money however I believe they are worth it.

I gave my son a St Croix Bank Robber for Christmas and asked for an Ion for it. They were out of that size Ion and I had waited too long to order one... I opted for another, much more expensive (Galvan Torque), though there were plenty of other brands available at the Ion price point... Just an FYI for the OP.

The Torque was discounted because the shop had more than he wanted to carry through the season...

Thought they fixed this? I seem to remember having to replace some parts in my Rhythms a while back, and I have not seen any problems since. While I don't quite get to test them as hard as Hap does, they've performed well on steelhead to 30", so I've been happy with them. That being said, I've given up on Ross with their new lines completely. A real shame considering what a reliable company they used to be.

I have fought stripers who peeled off a fly line and 75 yards of backing on old school Click & Pawl, standard arbor reels and had no problems fighting them. Granted it take two hands if you are gonna hold the rod and palm/pinch a reel's spool, but it is a whole lot more exciting BEING the drag mechanism than merely just one handing a hot fish until he quits running. It ain't the reel, but rather the fisherman who completes the fight! A softer rod; ie old school, low modulous graphite, fiberglass or bamboo put the fight to a fish, and absorb much more of the pressure. Besides, nothing sings like a Hardy LRH and a hot fish peeling line!

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Originally Posted by chewydog

Get a Lamson and don't look back. And, we need pics of the falling out of the boat episode for rating purposes.

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Thankfully the camera wasn't out yet for that!

I like the Bass Pro Hobbs Creek reels. Cast aluminum, disc drag. Just redneck enough to make people turn up their noses and scoff at them. On the other hand, I own several, none of which have EVER failed in any way, including on a fish. I have landed thousands of trout and several hundred steelhead on them. No complaints. And 40 bucks, so you can buy reels instead of extra spools.

Then again, the largest fish I have landed on a fly rod (47# chinook), so far, was caught on a clicker reel, and I would not hesitate to do it again. I see absolutely no need to spend a couple hundred dollars on a high end reel for trout.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...11705_1_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...10905_6_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...20905_4_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ropped_low.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...22904_b_lc.jpg

and so on, and so on...

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Originally Posted by DG

I like the Bass Pro Hobbs Creek reels. Cast aluminum, disc drag. Just redneck enough to make people turn up their noses and scoff at them. On the other hand, I own several, none of which have EVER failed in any way, including on a fish. I have landed thousands of trout and several hundred steelhead on them. No complaints. And 40 bucks, so you can buy reels instead of extra spools.

Then again, the largest fish I have landed on a fly rod (47# chinook), so far, was caught on a clicker reel, and I would not hesitate to do it again. I see absolutely no need to spend a couple hundred dollars on a high end reel for trout.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...11705_1_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...10905_6_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...20905_4_lc.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ropped_low.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...22904_b_lc.jpg

and so on, and so on...

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You make a very good case!

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Originally Posted by rawfish

I am also trying to decide if the orvis clearwater reel is a good choice (although noone has mentioned it)

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We sell the Orvis Clearwater and the Encounter and they have been very well received. Many of our customers use the Clearwater IV and Encounter IV in saltwater. We have not had a complaint come back to us yet. That said, the reel has only been on the market for about 18 months so I don't have any long term usage feedback. Seems like a well constructed reel though and a good value.

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Originally Posted by tailingloop

We sell the Orvis Clearwater and the Encounter and they have been very well received. Many of our customers use the Clearwater IV and Encounter IV in saltwater. We have not had a complaint come back to us yet. That said, the reel has only been on the market for about 18 months so I don't have any long term usage feedback. Seems like a well constructed reel though and a good value.

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Thank you, for now I have it down to the Echo Ion or the Clearwater as my daily reel.