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Cane for Bamboo??
I have not attempted to build a rod yet, but, I can tell that it won't be long before the "bug" bites me! http://www.flyanglersonline.com/bb/smile.gif I was just wondering if the riverbottom cane we have here can be used to build a rod with like the bamboo is used? I know where one could get some that will push the 3" diameter size and was wondering if this material could be used or if it is not usable. Has anyone tried this material and what were the results?
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Warren
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Not sure what you are talking about for cane, but why go through all the work of building a rod to end up with something that may not work. Golden Witch offers a sample pack for $64.00 that you will be able to build a couple of rods from.
Pete
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CTCaneman,
Maybe I did not word my post properly. I do not intend to use rivercane. A friend of mine builds fly rods and I have seen his stock of bamboo in his shop for spliting and building bamboo rods with. I asked him once if he had ever tried using the riverbottom cane that grows along our rivers here and I am sure elsewhere for a cane rod. He said that he has never seen rivercane that was big enough in diameter for spliting and making a rod from. He stated that it needs to be at least 3" in diameter so that the walls would be thick enough for rods. Now that I have found a patch of it that has some cane in it that is close to 3" I was just wondering if any of the bamboo rod makers on FAOL have ever tried using it and what the end results were. I have another friend of mind that is a guide and also builds bamboo rods and he told me he would love a piece of it because he has wondered the same thing. He thinks it may work. So, I am not saying I plan to try it. I was just wondering if someone already has tried it and what the results were. If it is worthless material for cane rods then I do not need to cut any to try. I was just looking for feedback and nothing more from someone who has tried it.
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Warren
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Way back around the turn of the last century bamboo rods were built from Calcutta cane. The bad news is that this cane produces a soft, limp fly rod. The good news was that this was the days of the wet fly and these rods were not too bad for that. Then -- the discovery of "Tonkin" cane. This is the cane which has been favored for fly rods ever since. Thick power fibers. good distance between nodes and most importantly the perfect stiffness for a nice dry fly rod. Unfortunatly this is grown only in a small area of China. When the communists took over, trade was restricted and the supply of tonkin cane dried up. Lots of folks searched in vain for a satisfactory replacement cane and tried to grow tonkin in other places. No one was successful.
But -- there is a builder in Argentina who I believe is building with a cane native to Argentina, and from all reports he is producing a rod which not only has wonderful stiffness but is magnificently built. True works of art.
So -- should you try it? Why not? I might not put too much $$ into fittings for my first try, but other than some time and $$ what have you got too loose? Hey you might even discover something worthwhile.
Agmd
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AgMD,
Thank you for the info. I really appreciate it. I hope to find out if our cane will work or not soon. Thanks again.
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Warren
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Those Argentina rods are produced by Marcello Calviello and the rod company is Calviello & Trucco. They do magnificant work and the bamboo is grown right there in the rain forests. The interesting thing about their rods is that the ferrules are bamboo as well. I think that Marcello developed most of the tapers they are using as well.
Several people have tried making bamboo rods out of domestic cane but have found that the walls of the bamboo are too porus and the power fibers are not as strong as those of Tonkin or some of the other bamboo that is grown in more tropical climates. It would be interesting and nice as well to see someone develop a different method of construction using domestic cane.
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Mike Brooks uses some native Cane from I believe Oregon. He makes a green rod and there is a black species he likes but says very expensive.
I suppose you could use just about any bamboo, but the quality and flexiblity would be an issue. I have seen and cast one of Marcelo's Argentine bamboo rods, makes them with a bamboo ferrule, they are magnificent!!
Pete
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"In North America there are only three native species of bamboo as opposed to the 440 species native to Latin America"--this is from a bamboo growing site.
The only "woody" bamboo native to North America is the Arundinaria gigantea, which is what we call in Oklahoma: Switch Cane. This reaches a max height of about 12' and at it's largest is maybe 2"s in diameter. The problem with this cane is that the power fibers are not very thick and the cane tapers sharply so it would be tough to get some nice strips off of it.
I've tried to make a 2 strip quad from the switch cane but it is very very poor and I gave up on it. The other two bamboo we have in NA are basically short grasses.
If you have see larger bamboo with thicker walls these are probably an imported variety that has excaped domestication. Calcutta is another option to Tonkin but it's cost is about the same when you do the math.
Marcello Calviello from Argentina does some amazing work with his native cane, but I would imagine the importation would be a bugger.
Some locales in North America do grow some bamboo usually for ornamental purposes but there is nothing written where you couldn't try to make a rod from it. There are several consideration to this scheme though. If you decide to buy some culm of homegrown ornamental; again the cost might be the same as if you would have bought 3 12' culm of Tonkin from GoldenWitch. If you chose to grow your own you'll be years from a useable product. If you can find the imports with the proper characteristic growing wild you would still need to invest about a year into the proper curing to the culm. I cut some switch cane last summer and it's still a little green.
Please don't think I'm trying to discourage you about using alternate cane because, I'm very much like you, in the fact that I'm still searching for a source of decent cane around here. I'm just trying to save you some time if the river cane you saw was switch cane. If not go for it! Cut about a have dozen and put them in the rafters of you shed or barn.
Another out of the box source of some cheap cane to start with would be at Hobby Lobby for about 3 bucks. It says it comes from China but I have no idea what variety it is.
Hope this helps!
Mike
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Warren,
I have never made a cane rod from another variety than Tonkin but I, like you, have been intrigued by the idea and maybe I can point you in the right direction when evaluating cane for rodmaking (before you build it up and wiggle it). First off, the diameter has very little to do with the quality. In fact of the hundreds of culms which have passed through my shop, NONE have measured 3" or greater. To be honest, most of the culms over 2&1/2" are so beat up that they just don't cut it cosmetically. True, a larger culm (of the same variety) will usually contain a greater thickness of quality power fibers but this is usually only a valid concern on bigger rods, and even then only in the butt sections. What you want to look for when playing with different types of bamboo is the DENSITY of the power fibers. If a bamboo is 6" in diameter but the power fibers (which appear as brown dots from the cutoff view) are widely seperated by soft white pith, then it's no good and will produce a very sluggish rod. If you find a cane that grows to 60' but is only 1&1/2" in diameter, it will probably have very dense fibers and would be a much better candidate. Anyway, hope some of this is helpful at least and let us know what you find.
Bill O.
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[url=http://www.oysterbamboo.com:203fc]www.oysterbamboo.com[/url:203fc]
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Just to add a bit more to the conversaton,
Ron Kusse told us that Leonard tried growing
bamboo here in the US, I believe in Louisana.
They gave up, but I don't remember for sure
why.
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LadyFisher, Publisher of
FAOL