Tying Parachutes...a follow up

Thank you everyone for your excellent answers.
So I have tried over the last couple of days to tie parachutes with a whole host of materials thanks to all your advice and have a few follow up questions:
1. When tying parachutes using quill or feather type wings (turkey feathers, mallard etc), how do you make the wing stiff enough to use as a parachute, I tried making a thread base like on a hair or yarn wing and it just mushed up the wings or wouldnt wrap around them?
2. Is it possible to have a hackle feather that is too stiff to wrap around a parachute? Parachutes bend more than hooks and it seems like some hackle feathers are too stiff to tie around them?
Thanks

Quill wings are REALLY tough to use as a parachute post....but not impossible. First, put a couple of drops of a fairly viscous head cement or fingernail polish at the base of the quill. The quill will drink this up. Do it again ....and perhaps again until the base of the wings are supersaturated with the cement.
LET IT DRY COMPLETELY.
Now you have a stiff base to carefully wrap some thread( and put a touch more head cement here)., then attach your feather and gently wrap your parachute.

The trick is to make a stiff base that wont deform from the pressure of the hackle.

You may wrap ONLY on the stiff base. The slightest touch of a wrap on any portion of the unprepared quill will cause the wings to "mush up".

The answer to your second question is "Yes".


Best,
Black Gnat

Turkey T-base makes a nice wing, but if I were just starting out, I'd go with poly yarn, or antron.. It's cheap, easy-to-use and works fine. Here's instructions for tying a Gulper Special:
http://flyfisherman.com/Learn2Tie/gulperspecial/
To stiffen the post, add a little super-glue or head cement.

Regards,
Scott

Rawfish,

Maybe you are having 'how to' troubles. You can EASILY wrap hackle around a single piece of thread for a parachute, it just won't 'stay' well.

You have to find a way to 'hold' the parachute tightly upright, under tension, while you wrap. Few materials you'd want on a fly are stiff enough to wrap the hackle around otherwise.

Just in case,

Buddy

Several layers of thread, tightly wrapped around the post base will make an adequate foundation for the hackle. Sometimes I add a drop of head cement to stiffen the area.

The trick is to keep lots of tension on the post while wrapping the base and to make careful touching wraps. I like to make one layer up the post and one layer down. With yarns this is easily acomplished if you add an extra 3"-4" of length to the post. This forms a good handle for gripping, you pull the yarn straight up with one hand while wrapping with the other. Finish the wrap by taking a few turns over the hook shank, this locks the tension in the post wraps. When finished wrapping the hackle trim the post to length.

For posts made of turket flats or other natural fibers it's just a little harder to grip, but the same logic applies.

You can often do a single soft wrap, then tighten the wrap by pulling on the bobbin while appling tension to the wing. Several of these in succession should result in a strong post base.

Make sure the post base is large enough to fit the hackle. 4 turns of hackle requires about 1/16" tall post base. Make the post wrap too small and the hackle will 'fall off' and unwind from the more flexible wing material.

Some like to reinforce the post by adding a small piece of 10-15 lbs monfiliment to the wing post fibers. The mono can be cut off flush to the hackle after the fly is finished.

rawfish,
I'm sure you've heard this before, but if you maneuver your vise so that the position of the post is parallel to the ground (in the same position your hook shank is during normal tying) it will be much easier. The wraps will not want to slide down the post when you have to let go of your bobbin during wrapping the post while you hold it taut with the other hand. Gravity on the bobbin will help keep the wraps tight when you let go to reach around and grab the bobbin again. It also puts the post in the position that you are most used to tying in. Just a thought.
Joe

Never heard that before. Makes a lot of sense. Thank you!

rawfish, I'm not checking to see what you know about fly tying, but do you tye 'paraloops' ? I didn't invent it and I just thought everyone must have seen or heard of it by now.

Antron (among other matl's tied in as a post but in the form of a tight loop are one way to go. Then you can fashion a gallows tool from a length of thin brazing rod... 1/16 I think..fasten it to your vice stem with a small hose clamp, then shape the gallows tool so it looks like a big question mark...but turned around with the short end pointing to the loop post...that puts the tension in the right place when you fix an ink pen spring just so that it can be attached to an eye bent in the gallows tool and the other end of the spring hooked into the antron loop. Holds good tension on the loop post. Now one can tye 'paraloops' with both hands and no loss of tension on the thread/bobbin/hackle. Hope I said that so it's even half understandable !

Joe, I like your idea on making the post parallel to the ground.

Cheers,

MontanaMoose