Comparadun Wing

I have never understood the reasons for the full 180 degree fan wing on the Comparadun. I get why it needs to be pointing out to the sides of the fly for flotation and to imitate legs, but don't get the reason for it to extend all the way across the top. To imitate the wing? Mayfly wings are not oriented that way. To aid in flotation? Hopefully, the middle part never touches the water. It would also seem to put more weight in a place that would make the fly less stable on the water and make it more prone to be blown over and blown around by the wind. Easier to tie, maybe, than splitting the wings? What about tying them as usual and then just trimming out the middle part that would seem, at least to me, to make them more top-heavy than they need to be. That would be pretty simple.

I have seen a couple of split wing CDC Comparadun tying videos but never a split wing deer hair one, and with the lightness of CDC it probably isn't as necessary to eliminate the center portion of the CDD wing as it would with deer hair. And before I get attacked by the Traditionalists, I understand it would no longer be a true Comparadun. I also know it would look much more like a deer hair spinner but without the wider silhouette of the spinner's wings.

I'm sure I'm missing the reason for that part of the wing being there because I don't own and haven't read all of Hatches, so I need your help understanding.

Joe

Joe,
As you say, the primary purpose is to provide the "outrigger" floatations and stability. The 180 also gives a bit of silhouette of "wings" even though the "wings" aren't divided. When you fish them and see them on the water they do look like they have wings (at a bit of distance).

Hi Joe, This isn't exactly what you were talking about but the winging style on these emergers works really well. The deer hair is set in a dubbing loop spun and wound then split. They land superbly and float really well. You can use this technique for dun imitations as well. It isn't restricted to deer hair either, CdC and snowshoe hare also work really well. It does correct the problem of orientation of the wing you mentioned.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...5_edited-2.jpg
Cheers,
A.

I think that one advantage of the full 180 degree wing is that it is easier for the fisherman to see on the water. This is especially useful when making longer casts to spooky fish.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rainbowchaser

I think that one advantage of the full 180 degree wing is that it is easier for the fisherman to see on the water.

---

I agree with rainbowchaser.

Could never get them right so I switched to Spunduns; easier for me to tie right and the butts make a great pfd to help with floatation.

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0ac129e7.jpg

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1de38e69.jpg

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9241b715.jpg


Regards,
Scott

Tie them however you like. It is much faster to tie a fanned wing than any alternative if you are comfortable with the pattern, but I've always assumed the full wing was meant to imitate wings in motion, but I would bet economy of effort was the real reason. Tie them your way and see if they perform differently...my bet is they won't, but experimentation is what tying is all about.

If you are actually trying to ask 'why is pattern X not more realistic', then that's a different thread. None of our patterns are particularly realistic...but that's another thread...

I agree with Whatfly.
It is not a matter of how you achieve the fanwing.
We often seem to forget that the trout does not see the fly on the water as well as we see it in our vise. When they see a fly on the water, they are impaired by the mirror effect of the water surface, water surface disturbances (waves, micro currents, etc.). They don't see much detail until they are quite close which is often after they have committed.

"To aid in flotation? Hopefully, the middle part never touches the water."

I'm confused by this. Middle part of what, exactly?

Because it was tied that way originally....and it catches a helluvalotta fish. Need there be another reason? :)

I never questioned the effectiveness of the pattern. It is outstanding. It's fun to tie and especially fun to fish because it is so good. I tie and fish them with both the deer hair wing and, in the smaller sizes, a CDC wing. I'm going to try Davie McPhail's pattern with both materials in the wing. I was just curious as to a part of the fly that didn't seem to add anything to it, but the suggestions of visibility and ease of tying answer my question. Thanks!

Joe

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NJTroutbum

Because it was tied that way originally....and it catches a helluvalotta fish. Need there be another reason? :)

---

Actually, there were two(2) original 'comparaduns' tied by Caucci/Nastasi. There was one that had both a 180* hairwing WITH a hackle collar, and one that ONLY had the 180* hairwing. The former appears in the C/N book, Fly Tyer's Color Guide (p 153+). As explained to me by Caucci, the pattern without the hackle (the latter one), was as good as the one with the hackle, insofar as floatation and fish catching, was more durable and easier/faster to tye. So they dropped the use of the hackled comparadun in personal use and in the flies sold in the shop.

Allan

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Joe Billingsley

I never questioned the effectiveness of the pattern. It is outstanding. It's fun to tie and especially fun to fish because it is so good. I tie and fish them with both the deer hair wing and, in the smaller sizes, a CDC wing. I'm going to try Davie McPhail's pattern with both materials in the wing. I was just curious as to a part of the fly that didn't seem to add anything to it, but the suggestions of visibility and ease of tying answer my question. Thanks!

Joe

---

Joe,
Don't forget the semblance of a wing. Picture a comparadun style fly with all the fawning in the middle part of the fawning clipped out....the fly would still float with the deer hair at the 180 degree position, but would no longer offer the impression of wings......

Could it be that the fully upright hackles might aid somewhat in assuring that the fly not land upside down?

Sort of the angle the trout might see the fly. Both flies tied similarly. Although he would not see it as clearly and only when quite close, to me, at least, the first pic (with the interior deer hair clipped), appears more like a spinner than the second?

http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5332cba1.jpg


http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/...ps36fb5dc3.jpg

Nice ties, Byron. Like I said at first, it would seem more like a spinner (from above the water) but the hair wouldn't be spread out on the surface as wide as spinner wings. It just looks a lot more stable to me and less prone to be blown over on its nose.

Joe

Joe,

Could it have anything to do with preventing the fly from the helicopter effect and twisting light tippets?

Just a thought.

You guys have posted some nice ties in this thread.

Jeremy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Joe Billingsley

Nice ties, Byron. Like I said at first, it would seem more like a spinner (from above the water) but the hair wouldn't be spread out on the surface as wide as spinner wings. It just looks a lot more stable to me and less prone to be blown over on its nose.

Joe

---

Joe, I have fished the comparadun style flies for years, and, for mayflies it is my go-to pattern. I have never had a stability problem. Remember, this style lays pretty flush in/on the surface. They are very stable.