Not a Major Consumer?

Hi Folks,

Let me start off by saying that I am an enthusiastic fly fisherman who fishes at least three times a week during the season (often much more and BTW the season is long here in SC). I bought a lot of new fly fishing equipment when I returned to the sport in 2001. I purchased "bang for the buck" equipment which included several complete Orvis Clearwater outfits and several Cabela's Clear Creek outfits which ranged from $140-$250. Given some old equipment I still had, including a couple of Medalist reels, I can select an ideal outfit for any type of fishing I chose from small-stream brook trout to medium saltwater fish like reds or bones. I've got a pair of neoprene waders and a very nice pair of breathables. Two pairs of wading boots (one felt and stud sole for streams and one plain rubber sole for lakes and ponds. I've got two vests fully stocked with nippers, forceps, fly boxes, etc., one for cold water and one for warm water both all set to go. There is also some stray stuff like a wading staff, rain jacket, stripping basket and a couple of hats.
Sorry to make you read all that but I needed to set the stage before getting to my question. Even though I fish regularly, I buy almost no fly fishing equipment any more. Since I tie my own flies, I'm usually picking up a couple of leaders, a spool of tippet, or a tin of floatant. I had to replace a stream thermometer this spring and may replace a well worn fly line. Other than that, I'm not even tempted to spend money. I have no desire for Super Duper New Rod which will allow you to throw a fly line at the speed of light or a new wading staff with an automatic self-righting feature. I'm just not an equipment junkie and have all the stuff that I need. I will replace what is used up, wears out or breaks but that's about it. I bare no ill feelings toward equipment junkies or those who enjoy fishing with the very best equipment that they can afford. I also realize that the fly fishing industry is going to be in trouble if there are a lot of people around like me who aren't interested in their new and improved yearly offerings. What I was wondering was how many of our FAOL members are basically non-consumers of additional fly fishing equipment at this time by free choice? How many have all the stuff they need or want?
Don't worry Denny, fly tying is another story altogether. 8T :)

8T,

Me too.

I have all the rods and reels and the like I'll ever need.

I buy tying supplies, and, like you, leaders/tippet/consumables, but that's it.

The rod/durable fly equipment sellers can't make it on selling to the 'already fly fishing' folks....they have to grow the sport or they are doomed.

Just a part of business, though. In tough times those who cant' compete, or make the wrong choices, will go away and the efficient and smart ones will prosper.

Buddy

I don' have the biggest or the best, but what I got & use suits me just fine! My rods range from 3wt to 7wt & I've got as many 'toys' as I need. My tying equipment & supplies are the same way. What I tie Works well enough even though it doesn't exactly match what you see in the magazines & on line
A lotta that high speed high dollar stuff is designed to catch nimrod fishermen, not necessarily fish.
F'ya wanna go fishin' , fine let's go! F'ya wanna impress someone with yer equipment & skill...one's obvious & the other soon will be. H-m-m-m? Seems like I read that some where on this board. Wink wink

I agree with and am pretty much like shortcaster. My three rods range from a new graphite 5wt, a very old fiberglass 6/7wt, and a new graphite 7wt. I use my old Pflueger Medalist reel for both the 5wt and 6/7wt depending on what flyline I am using. I still buy flytying material, hooks, and leader material in limited amounts as needed when I can sneak it by SWMBO/SCA :p. Jay (Trout 5 Jay 0) :rolleyes:

8T,

My rods are all, mostly, blue-collar bamboo. I fish them all as they are all built for different waters or species of fish. I am constantly on the lookout for trade-ups or good buys, although there are a few rods I'll probably never sell.
I have way too many reels and should probably divest myself of some of them.
I do not tie flies so I'm always on the lookout for good buys on them. A few leaders and tippet material is pretty much the extent of my new purchases each year. Will buy new waders and boots when the others wear beyond repair.

If I did fish plastic exclusively, I could be most happy with a few rods in the price range you suggest. I also have no problem with others buying and fishing the very best of rods and reels. I wish I could sometimes.....but not very often. I'm content with what I have. By the way, wish I could fish as often as you!

Bob

Shops and manufacturers need a constant flow of beginning anglers.

The end.

Best, Dave

Where I got hung up was with the word, afford. I mess that all up with the word, rationalization. I do that with most things I get. I rationalize how much I can afford for them. More or less, how much am I willing to shell out. Over time, values change and priorities evolve. These have a bearing on the final outcome. Sometimes things of high cost are acquired and other times those of lessor cost are purchased.

VEE and I are waaaayyyyy past the concept of needing things, either for fishing (rods, reels, etc) and tying (hackle, dubbing, etc). For tying, the only things I need are those items I run out of like hooks and thread. Unfortunately we are in the stage of wanting things and there really is very little we want. When we hit a new fly shop (not a big box store) we try to find a few things to buy to help support the shop (tippet, mucellin, a few flies) but you can only carry so much tippet. It's getting hard to find stuff we just can't live without.

Fortunately, we belong to a fly fishing club that has an influx of new members, some well heeled, some not, that we can point in the direction of our friends like Denny Conrad, Bill Taylor, John Channer, and suppliers of good equipment like the sponsors here.

It's in our own best interest to get as many new people involed in the sport as we can to keep the shops open and costs down. With that though, goes the responsibility of teaching proper stream ettiquette and responsible use of a finite resource.

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Originally Posted by Eight Thumbs

Hi Folks,

Let me start off by saying that I am an enthusiastic fly fisherman who fishes at least three times a week during the season (often much more and BTW the season is long here in SC). I bought a lot of new fly fishing equipment when I returned to the sport in 2001. I purchased "bang for the buck" equipment which included several complete Orvis Clearwater outfits and several Cabela's Clear Creek outfits which ranged from $140-$250. Given some old equipment I still had, including a couple of Medalist reels, I can select an ideal outfit for any type of fishing I chose from small-stream brook trout to medium saltwater fish like reds or bones. I've got a pair of neoprene waders and a very nice pair of breathables. Two pairs of wading boots (one felt and stud sole for streams and one plain rubber sole for lakes and ponds. I've got two vests fully stocked with nippers, forceps, fly boxes, etc., one for cold water and one for warm water both all set to go. There is also some stray stuff like a wading staff, rain jacket, stripping basket and a couple of hats.
Sorry to make you read all that but I needed to set the stage before getting to my question. Even though I fish regularly, I buy almost no fly fishing equipment any more. Since I tie my own flies, I'm usually picking up a couple of leaders, a spool of tippet, or a tin of floatant. I had to replace a stream thermometer this spring and may replace a well worn fly line. Other than that, I'm not even tempted to spend money. I have no desire for Super Duper New Rod which will allow you to throw a fly line at the speed of light or a new wading staff with an automatic self-righting feature. I'm just not an equipment junkie and have all the stuff that I need. I will replace what is used up, wears out or breaks but that's about it. I bare no ill feelings toward equipment junkies or those who enjoy fishing with the very best equipment that they can afford. I also realize that the fly fishing industry is going to be in trouble if there are a lot of people around like me who aren't interested in their new and improved yearly offerings. What I was wondering was how many of our FAOL members are basically non-consumers of additional fly fishing equipment at this time by free choice? How many have all the stuff they need or want?
Don't worry Denny, fly tying is another story altogether. 8T :)

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In some ways I wish I thought more like you. But honestly I love the equipment almost as much as the fishing itself.

Greg

I enjoy fly fishing and have been doing it, almost exclusively, for 35+ years. I have waaay too many other interests/priorities to be obsessed with it or any of it's equipment. As to what I need, I have all and now buy only consumables mentioned before. Most of my friends wouldn't know from fly fishing. A thousand customers/consumers like me could not support a local fly shop and maybe smart marketers haven't opened one here for THAT reason. I'm probably more interested in WHERE I fish and fishing rather than in what I fish with. I've mentioned this in earlier posts, I'm not a fly fisherman, I fly fish.

Mark

Im in the same camp as Ree. He knows. Hes met one of my foster boys. None of the boys we get have ever fly fishd. Rashan the one Ree met, is coming along full circle just fine. I got him an older glass rod, older Pluger reel w line and now hes tying flies right beside me. He is also learning C&R and taking real interest in keeping rivers cleaned up. I know I sound mushy, but its awesome taking these young pups out and teaching them right. Oh yeah, he also borrows one of my blue collar Boo rods also.

I have had pretty good graphite rods and reels. I kind of like having nice things when I can afford them ( without rationalizing too much, JC ). BUT, my first three rods were a used rod and two closeout rods, and though they might be considered high end by some, they came to me for very reasonable prices. The next rod, a Winston Ibis, came to me free in a raffle. The last one, a Sage Fli 7 wt, is the only one I paid full retail for. It filled a niche called big water, big wind, big flies that my other rods really didn't want to fish.

THEN I MADE THE MISTAKE OF TRYING A BAMBOO ROD. The one I have been using is a good rod, and I made a pretty good deal to get it. Unfortunately, I am now on the verge of stepping up for a really special 3 wt bamboo and a 3 wt Hexagraph. Haven't made the deal yet, and it may not happen. If it doesn't, I'll probably still be looking for some bamboo to add to my collection, but will likely move out a couple graphite rods if I do.

As far as reels, lines, leaders ( homemade furled ), fly tying tools and materials, I'm pretty well set. Most of the stuff I tie is as simple as I can make it, and I tend to fish a very small selection of flies over the course of the year, which means I only buy hooks and thread occasionally, and new materials seldom.

John

P.S. REE - when you are Jimmy's, stock up on T-shirts.

My son ties all the flys, and builds all the rods so I don't have to worry about the new stuff.

I do attend a lot of auctions specifically looking for fishing equipment. My father collected equipment as his uncle did before him and I have inherited the entire collection, a lot of it dating back to the early 1900's, and continue to add to it when I find anything of interest. Not much of it is used for my fishing. It sits in cabinets and boxes. I have been fishing for 60 some odd years and I havent thrown anything away either so there is a bunch of it.

Biggest problem is sneaking anything I buy past my wife and getting it put away before she sees it. I always catch a lot of grief when she sees me bringing "new" old equipment in to add to the collection.

I fall into the category of seeing my quiver as half full. :rolleyes: I recently bought two new setups, a singled handed and 2-handed. :D Just doing my part to help the economy.

I agree with you. I find myself buying far less actual fishing related items (rods, reels, vests, etc.). Not so long ago it seems I always wanted "more". I suppose I had the idea in my head that there was a rod, reel, what have you, that would make me catch more fish or perhaps enjoy fishing more. Somewhere along the line though, I realized that by simply wanting what I had and enjoying it, I could fully enjoy the simple pursuit of actually fishing. I've got some very nice graphite rods in weights 3 through 8 that cover all of the fishing I do around here and I've got a nice bamboo rod that I'll use on "special" trips and I enjoy each of them tremendously. However, my enjoyment of the rods pales compared to my enjoyment of just being out there fishing. Now, instead of being out there wondering if I might have made that cast if I had the latest model rod, I'll think "I might have made that cast if I practiced more with the rod I've already got". And instead of always wanting "more" I find myself enjoying just being there on the water regardless of if I am catching fish or not.

Of course fly tying is a whole other matter. I'm still a sucker for beautiful fly tying materials...

-Darryl

I've always taken the attitude that those that buy a lot of stuff usually are making up for something.........

God bless the gear heads, because they help keep the companies afloat. If I had unlimited funds, I know I'd be buying equipment just because it's beautiful. But I don't and I'm just a minor consumer as well. Most of the money I spend at the local fly shop is for tying materials. I almost feel guilty going in there.

There are a number of reasons to buy equipment. Wants, needs, beauty, perfomance. I had a college professor years ago who asked me to help get his motorcycle into the freight elevator of the art building. As we went up to the third floor studios where it was to serve as a model for a drawing class, I commented about enjoying riding, and he told me he really doesn't enjoy riding. In answer to the obvious question of why did he buy one, then, he responded with awe, "Look at it! It's beautiful! How could I not own it?" And that is as good a reason as any. I think he got as much out of his as I did out of my old Kawasaki triple. Is a fly reel any different?

I thought of him when I built a rod simply because I found a mother of pearl reel seat that I just had to build a rod for.

Thumbs, RW here,

Did anyone define what a major consumer is? Do we have to put a monetary value on what a major consumer is? At what time do you stop becoming a major consumer? How about what is a minor consumer? If you have been buying fishing tackle for over 60 years I would think you would be a major consumer. I have enough gear and tackle to open a small sporting goods store. Are you considering just this year? Or do you consider a major consumer to be his/her aquisitions over a lifetime? I believe those questions have to be established before that question can be answered. Are we including boats for fishing in a lifetime, expensive fishing vacations taken, books on the subject ( I would definitely qualify there.) fishing clothes, boots, waders, etc. etc. There's a lot to consider. Your question is very general in nature.

rw

Hi RW,

It's always nice to see you checking in on the BB. I guess my question deals with the person who goes into a fly shop and is tempted by all the new and improved offerings that are found each year---the lighter, faster, more breathable etc., etc., etc. So my question to you would be, with all the stuff you have, do you still make major purchases of rods, reels, waders and boots? If so, than you are still a major consumer, If you honestly believe that you've got all the rods, reels, boots, waders that you need, then you are a minor consumer. You make an excellent point about vacations, books and boats. To me vacations are consumables and don't count because you can't keep using them again as you can a fly rod. Boats are another activity altogether but can be thought of in the same way. Do you have a good boat but keep trying to upgrade to a bigger, faster or newer boat? Books, ah books, love them and I can't stop buying them. Fly tying material is the same situation as books, love it though even here I buy less. Hope that covers most of your questions. Consumerism is not so much a monetary variable as it is a mental variable---do you want more of what you already have? 8T :)

Well I am a newbie to the sport so I am still getting the collection I want or should may not possibly need, LOL. But I have noticed a lot lately that a lot of places have the trade up program going. I am doing that right now so to speak with some of my equipment that does not get as much use.
I seem to be getting the higher price range equipment that I use most of the time and spending less on rods that might get two to three times use for a certain species.
But the sport is growing pretty good from what I have seen in Ontario, a lot of folks trying it out at shows and loving it from the time they pick up thier first rod and cast it.

I do not think there will be a problem and if there is, we will see price drops which I believe has happend somewhat.

Mike

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Bad Wulff

I've always taken the attitude that those that buy a lot of stuff usually are making up for something.........

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That's really a bit judgmental don't you think? Personally even though I'm kind of a gear collector (rod and reels anyway) I'm not making up for anything. I have a great life (happily married, good job, great kids) and I'm a pretty decent fly fisherman too.

Greg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Bad Wulff

I've always taken the attitude that those that buy a lot of stuff usually are making up for something.........

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"Interests: golf, dirt bike riding, fishing......all the expensive and hard-to-do stuff"
So BBW, what is it you are making up for? :rolleyes::wink:

My signature is sufficient for you to grasp my position on this topic.:lol:

Let's keep this discussion on a friendly footing and not fall into over-used stereotypes. Self-professed big spenders and self-professed tight wads are both just doing what makes them happy and increases their enjoyment of the wonderful sport of fly fishing. Neither end of this continuum represents insecurity, psychopathology or evil incarnate, We're all friends here so let's keep it that way 8T :)

For myself, I will obsess on something if I feel it will have a major impact on my success, and usually wont rest untill I've gotten it. After that, I want to be done with that purchase. If I need customer service anywhere in the process, well then, that to me is worth more than the item itself.I want to support those who are passionate enought about the sport to try to make a living at it. If I had lots of money, I might be gearhead for that reason alone.
The stuff itself interests me less.

I dont return to businesses who are rude,unresponsive, and wont back up their products. I have a pontoon boat that I actually like, but I wont upgrade with that Co. again because of poor customer service.Nor will I shop with the local shop who sold it to me, because of their unfortunate choice of 15 yr old shop clerks who made it necessary for me to contact the co in the first place. I will probably upgrade to a pontoon boat company that has the designers persons name right on the product.I will expect, and probably get better service.

For me,its all about the relationships involved with the purchase. Stuff is stuff, its value highly subjective and always changeing. But integrity people trying to make a go in an important sport like flyfishing will always have my attention and my business.I want them to succeed! When I get rich,I plan on buying lots of stuff from these fine folks. Untill then, I will get what I need from them,plus a little more... :D:D

I was in a shop several years ago, and they asked me "What could we stock that you would buy?". After thinking a bit, "I have everything I need, and will likely only buy unusual items, or upgrades to my tackle from here on. On occasion I will replace a damaged, lost, or used-up item, but you really need to speak with beginners to stock for them."

Actually at this stage I'm tempted to post stuff on E-bay to clear my shelves. I have more toys than a small shop.

I've got more rods & reels than I need, but not as many as I want.

For example, I have two 5 wts. I originally justified the 2nd 5wt for use as a "back-up" in case damage or theft should befall my "go-to" combo. I actually use them both at different times.
Now I'm sort of wishing I had a shorter 4wt or 5wt that might be easier for my kids (and their friends) to learn on. They could probably get by with one of my rods...but kids aren't always careful with stuff, and I dearly love my 2 5wts.
So... its not a new rod isn't a high priority right now, but I am starting to give it serious consideration. This means I'll probably get one later this year. ;)