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ok i admit using the wacky worm on spinfishing gear for bass. does anyone have a fly similar to the wacky worm? for those who don't know what a wacky worm rig is, it is a straight rubber worm hooked once through the middle. any input is always appreciated.
WWFF
You know i think I know what you mean there this would be a great challenge to try and come up with new pattern to work like the wacky worm.
I don't know if I have ever seen that before but am going to do some surfing and. And if I come up with any ideas or patterns i will get back to you.
How would a piece of small chenille, San Juan worm size, with the hook tied perpendicular to the center body, which should be coated with clear silicone or maybe a flexible liquid plastic coating work?
Having used a wacky worm style of fishing before (it can be extremely effective!) I have tried a couple of different methods to reproduce this on a fly rod; all with very little success. Since I was using synthetics anyway, I started asking myself why not use a rubber worm on a fly rod? Somehow this doesn't seem right to me so I'm right back where I started. I use a wacky worm style for bass on my spinning rod when the urge strikes me and I flyfish the rest of the time.
Jim Smith
Well I saw a spin guy doing really well on smallies
with a wacky so when I got a chance
I sat down at the desk and just x tyed in some
long slender black hackle about mid shank on a
#6 something or other hook and though it worked
well in the water, I've yet to hook a bass with it.
I may try something with marabou
this next time because after seeing that guy
with the rubber wacky doing well when I wasn't
kinda inspired me to stick with it.
I can see where the chennile could work too.
The guy with the rubber wacky was fishing the
rig dead drift, unweighted in barely moving water...
...every once in a while he'd wiggle the rod tip side to side.
I'm not sure but I think the feathers I'm using are too stiff
but I was using larger hackles to get the 8 to 10 inch length
I wanted, which was about what the rubber worm length was.
Anyway, good luck finding something in a 'wacky worm fly' or
inventing something of your own !
Cheers,
MontanaMoose
Been working on this for a few years now.
Here's the 'problem' that needs to be overcome before this will 'work'.
What makes the 'Whacky Rig' so effective is the hydrodynamics involved. It's not just the 'shape' of the worm, nor is it the weight of the worm, or even where the hook is placed in the worm.
What makes it so effective is the combination of all three.
The worm itself has a lot of 'mass' to it. The soft plastic used for these baits is pretty heavy, and most of the more successfull worms for this style of fishing also contain quite a bit of salt, making them even heavier.
The 'round' cross section of the worm causes it to wobble or 'shimmy' as it settles in the water. Yet it still retains some stiffness so that it does not just 'fold up'.
A properly rigged 'whacky worm' is hooked at a place on the body of the worm to balance it so that it falls with the bait 'horizontal' in the water. Where exactly this point of balance is varies from bait to bait, as not all of the 'worms' used for this are the same. The combination of this 'balance' and the mass of the worm falling against the resistance of the water will also cause the bait to 'slide' from side to side (towards the 'ends' of the worm) at times if it is falling on a 'slack' line.
Can you do this with a 'fly' that's castable? Maybe...maybe not.
Chenille will just 'fold up'. I tried using something to stiffen it. I tried wire, silicone, and glues, but it takes away all the movement of the chenille. I thought the silicone was 'promising', but it just doesn't work like the 'worm' does.
Also, with all of the 'chenille' options, you have to weight the hook so that the bait will fall fast enough. On the 'real thing' the hook is not the heaviest part of the rig....
Feathers are too light. They either fold up, or are too stiff. None seem to be able to hold enough water to cause any 'action' on their own. I spun a couple of hackles together with some wire, even tried 'coated' feathers. Wouldn't sink fast enough without way too much weight on the hook (caught too much water).
Bucktail was 'close'. Tying it on was fun, but doable. Kind of like posting wings...I had acouple of fish hit these. But the real problem was repeatability. 'Balance' was an issue...not all bucktail is created equal..still can work, but you have to spend some time playing with the weight on the hook (has to be BEHIND the bucktail), and getting the bait not to twist on the cast (it's like casting a propellar).
The real 'it may work well' option is the one I haven't got to use at the lake yet. What I've done is take a rabbit strip and run a bead of silicone sealant down the 'skin side' of the strip.
I cut some different sizes, and if you hook (hook still need some weight on it) them in the middle and pitch them into the water, they fall okay. No 'side to side' sway, but the hair gives it some built in action and I think it will catch fish.
Still worried about casting it, though. I can't figure out how to get the proper fall without having the hook in the middle of the fly. I can't figure out how to 'cast' such a thing without it spinning, and spinnning wildy.
We have the 'perfect' whacky rig bait out there now. Unfortunitly, it's made by Yamamoto and weighs too much to 'cast' with a fly rod.
I can, and do sometimes, swing a Senko on my 6 wt...can't 'cast' it, but I can flip it out far enough to catch some fish with it. These things catch BIG fish...
Buddy
Buddy,
Have you tried to tie in a piece of mono x-wise across the hook to stiffen up the chinelle? With all of the different diameters available, there should be one that would give the correct action.
The casting thing would seem to be the biggest issue. I can just see the leader after a few casts:(. Maybe a small swivel would help things out.
Kevin
I tied some rubber hackle on a size 18 hook in this style.
I did catch some fish on it but I think it needs more work to be really effective.
FlyfishDave sent me some of the material off the spiky balls( forgot the name).
This might work better for this style of fly.
Rick
I think you may be on to something, Rick:cool:.
Right, Rick, you might be able to do something with the bigger "legs"...like this one:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...JuanWeenie.jpg
The one above is tied on a size 10 hook, for reference.
Most of the legs on the rubber "puffer balls" are much smaller.
However, the big ones are probably only about 2" long (I'm guesstimating, since I'm at work). It sounds like the guys targeting bass would be wanting something substantially larger...like at least 5"+? It might work, but we really gotta find the right material/source.
What about strips of thin leather, reinforced with mono (like flychucker mentioned)?
...or...just had another thought...what about a chenille wound around the shaft of a pheasant tail? (Just thinking a turkey feather shaft or peacock tail shaft might be too stiff,.) That feather shaft should give it some stiffness, while allowing some movement when slowly retrieved? :confused:
Although the chenille when wet might be a bit heavy. The feather shaft not very durable (would probably break when you set the hook), but would provide the stiffness while remaining lightweight.
OK...maybe overall NOT a good idea?
I've got some titanium leaders I use for pike that might give some action and durability, and also doesn't kink. Wrap one of those with chenille.
Or just use a very STIFF monofilament line for the core beneath the chenille/feathers/leather/bugskin?
This one's actually pretty easy guys and gals. Of the options below, I have tried them all but usually use option #1. I'm not a real wacky worm fan, but have caught bass on them.
The neatest way is, of course, hook on a 4" plastic worm -- but then is it fly fishing? So this doesn't count as an option.
To be more fly fishing creative you have to address the issue of getting the fly to sink.
Option #1 is to use tube fly tubing and don't seal the ends. Hook a 4-6 inch piece crossways through the middle and fish away. Because tubing comes in a variety of colors and diameters, you can make a variety of wacky worms.
Option #2 is to cut three 1/4 inch wide strips of fun foam 4-6" long -- olive and orange and yellow. Glue them together (long ways) with super glue so you have a foam sandwich (like a chernobl on steroids). Taper the ends with scissors. This color combination is called wild fire tiger (hot bass color). Hook the WFT worm through the middle on a lead headed jig hook (otherwise it won't sink).
Option #3 is to buy wire stem chenille from Michael's or Hobby Lobby. Cut a piece and twist around the hook shank. If you use a barbed hook (shame on you) it will not come off. If you use a barbless hook (applause) you will have to put a layer of thread on the hook bend and then super glue the chenille to the thread.
thanks for the replies so far. has anyone tries braiding/ tying a few strands of rubber legs together? it would make it a little heavier but still have good action.
No, but you've just given me a great idea and next time I sit down to tye a wacky I'll braid black hackles together ... and that should give me the bulk that just one feather per side of my
current wacky lacks. Thanks WWFF.
Cheers,
MontanaMoose
Haven't tried it yet, but what about furled yarn? Furling it should give it some stiffness but it should remain soft enough to move a lot.
This is probably cheating, but what about using the stuff they make gummy minnows out of? You can layer it and cut to shape. You can put weight under it on the hook shank....just enough to get the propper sink rate.
How about taking a 1/2" piece of mylar tubing and sliding it halfway down a plastic worm. I would think a touch of adhesive would hold it and keep it from tearing off during the cast.
Has anybody tried braiding Larvae Lace, and tying it perdendicular? For more weight, you could tie a pair of Barbell eyes in the center.
I tried this last night. I didn't measure it, but would guess its about 2" long, on a #4 hook.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2..._WackyWorm.jpg
Here's a thread spool/bobbin for size comparison:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...ackyWorm_2.jpg
The rubber is thick, which should attract some bass. The movement should be pretty good, too. Its that type of rubber than you can stretch a LONG WAY, so durability should be decent (kind of hard to test this right now, with 14" of ice on the lakes). To help brace it, I cross-tied 2 "koosh-ball" rubber band legs around the "worm" and the hook shank. I tightened the rubber bands as good as I could. A pair of fly-tying pliers came in very handy for manipulating the rubber bands to make the knots.
It isn't as light as something made from feathers would be, but it should catch fish. The yellow one in the picture, I obviously just threaded onto a hook. That'll probably work too. :rolleyes:
I found these big "rubber worm" while I was standing in the checkout lane at Michael's craft store.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...m_material.jpg