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I had shoulder surgery about five weeks ago.Like everything else you here those famous words you have nothing to worry about.After all is said and done doc comes buy and says everything went ok,but during surgery found bicep musle tore in half and couldnt repair.I flyfish with both hands,and reel in with my right hand.If there is someone out on this forum with the same situation i would like to know how you deal with fishing.Just looking for some answers .
Good afternoon Ron.
Mate, its time.
Its time you too checked out the easy way to fly fish.
Its time for a Trout Spey Rod.
Then like me, you will think, why didn't I do this years ago !
If you would like an idea or three or a direction in little Spey rods, please feel free to yell out........
AND
I will flood you with ideas and suggestions. :P
Kind regards,
UB
Uncle Barry i think im going to take you up on that trout spey rod.Do you make your own or do you buy yours from a dealer?Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Barry
Good afternoon RonZ
"Uncle Barry i think im going to take you up on that trout spey rod.Do you make your own or do you buy yours from a dealer? "
Make our own.
We develope a concept, the design performance and then work through it all with a composite eng, from there after a number of trails, we then have someone roll the blank and 'stick' all the bits on.
Kind regards,
UB
I've gone through three of the bloody shoulder surgeries, all on the same right shoulder.
Learn to cast off-handed. It takes a little doing, but if Castwell can double haul with either hand the rest of us can learn to at least cast with our 'dumb' hand. You might be surprised at how good you can get! *S*
Why is spey casting easier on a shoulder? I'm not familiar with it. I've been having a hard time nymphing this year because of a bad right shoulder. Actually, both of my shoulders are bad. I was thinking of learning to nymph with my left arm, but I think it's just as bad.
Ladyfisher: I just finished with a physical therapist. She says everything feels tight and strong in my rotator cuff. She's said without seeing an MRI she'd guess I have arthritis in both shoulders. Being a veteran with shoulder problems do you have any advice?
:sad:LF, I've had both rotator cuffs reconstructed and can still cast with either hand, guess I was just lucky. There is a great article by Lefty Kreh in Flyfisherman magazine one or two issues ago oncasting with bad shoulders using a sidearm stoke, very informative, you might try to look it up.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by LadyFisher
Lefty Kreh's casting book has a chapter on shoulder pain and injury. it is written fly his surgeon. The Dr. explains that you cannot heal from shoulder ligament damage if you sleep with your arm under your head. I tried his suggestion to keep your arm inside a T shirt and was greatly relieved of a 3 year pain in about a week. Two months later, now, I feel cured. Two of my acquaintances have gotten relief from this approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by lastchance
I broke the had under the head habit in about a week.
I can't sleep that way because of the shoulder ache and pain I get. I only sleep that way by mistake.
I do a lot of highstick nymphing and it requires, as you know, keeping the arm raised for long periods. That's when the ache begins. I used to be able to fish 4 or 5 hours at a time before the pain. That window is closing steadily.
Good morning.
For starters to get things correct,
I did not write Spey casting is easier......etc
What I wrote was something about a TROUT Spey rod.
Because, its almost too easy to use.........that simple.
High sticking nymphing, where you have your hands up reached.
With an extra 3 feet of rod length, you no longer have the hand way up in the sky kind of thing.
Trout Spey rods are very light.
Like most things, if you share a pick-up load with two hands its super light and easy, the same applies to fly rods.
Casting, you don't have to lift your hand about your shoulders.
AND STILL
Cast 75 to 80 feet from a single Spey, snake roll, underhand cast.
I've heard it all before, and once a caster sees a smooth easy cast from someone with some casting skill, their ideas change fast, result, that want that rod, and in each and every case, the person never asks how much, how many dollars will it cost, unlike the single handed rod purchase.
Is there a message there ?
I've heard the Double isn't suitable for tight over grown locations, time and time again, BUT that claim is always from no owners of little Doubles...hey is'nt that odd ?
Not suitable for boats or saltwater, again funny tales from non Double owners.
Kind regards,
UB
Disclaimer : I design, have made, sell, teach casting and use Double rods.
Uncle Barry: I totally misread your post, and you're right--you didn't say easier spey rods are easier to cast. Is a spey rod just a longer rod? If so, then the longer the rod, the lower I can keep my arm when nymphing? If I understand now, that really could help me on the stream.
Good morning LastC.
Yes, a Spey rod is a longer rod.
Normally in the Trout sizes, 5/6w a Spey rod would be around 12feet in length.
YES, you could decide on some power casts and lift your arms up above your shoulders, however you don't have to with the little Doubles, keep your arms lower than your shoulders, keep your arms in to your body, and you will still have enough power in the rod to cast amazing distances.
Why, its all because of the tip speed, the longer the rod, the higher the tip speed, which equals higher line speed, which results in a longer cast.
Kind regards,
UB
There is an alternative to a 'roll cast' or 'backcasting' when fishing nymphs or wets/emergers that should help those that have shoulder problems!
You let the line finish your drift downstream and lower your rod parallel to the water. This 'loads the rod' for your next cast. You then raise your rod about 45^, then flick the rod quickly( toward your target) keeping your arm close to your side!
I learned this method from a recent DvD I bought on 'advanced nymph fishing'. It works so well, I rarely roll cast more........... FWIW.
Quill, I do this a lot, but never have figured out how to change angles - that is, from directly downstream of me to straight out from me, rather than straight upstream. Have you got the system for that?
To change your target area( in the stream), you would have to change your standing position in the stream; which becomes somewhat limited. You should basicly be casting up/across to let the nymph sink.Quote:
Originally Posted by herefishy
If you have to cast directly across ( for some reason).......... I would think you would have to fish with much less line to get there. You won't be able to do that if you are trying to cast a long line. If you are wading downstream to fish an area, I wouldn't think that would be a problem.
Try a snakeroll.Quote:
Originally Posted by herefishy
Kudos to Uncle Barry.After reading this even my therapists would have agreed with you.You are one smart gentlemen.Ok..Now how much will one of those 5 weights go for?Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Barry
Good afternoon
"You are one smart gentlemen.
Ok..Now how much will one of those 5 weights go for? "
Please not too smart, 'I've just been there and done that', before you, thats all. ;)
How much will a 5w Double cost.
Question, a complete rod or a blank ?
Kind regards,
UB
The complete rod.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Barry
A thought from somebody who does not own and has never case a long rod; but I have had numerous other dealings with Uncle Barry amd I assure you that he is a gentleman and will not do you wrong; nor will he try to give you something you do not need. ;)
Dear Gringo.
How could I ever repay you, for such kind words ?
Maybe when you come fishing, I could bring along one of my girl friends for you ?
But then again, maybe, maybe, if I just send you a cheque will be enough.
This will of course, allow you far more time for the fishing ;)
Kind regards,
UB
ps, its about time you picked up a Trout Spey, young grass hopper .
KOA, I have been looking at youtube for how to do a snakeroll, but they are all so fast, I can't get the drift of it, do you start with a roll cast, then cast it downstream, then up? What are the anchor points they talk about.Quote:
Originally Posted by KOA-1
Ron, berfore you buy a spey rod, although I have cast and fished one and they are excellent, read Lefty Kreh's article in fly fisherman magazine Dec. 2008. He has excellent advice on side arm casting with your arm close to your side for shoulder problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie Z
Good evening Herefish.
I might be able to help clear the fog for you,
"I have been looking at youtube for how to do a snakeroll, but they are all so fast,"
Thats normal, it looks fast, because the line in in the air going around and around, if not fast, it will fall in a heap around your ears :D
" I can't get the drift of it, do you start with a roll cast,"
Wrong, you finish with a roll cast, single Spey.
The cast basically is.
Tight line to reel,
rod tip low, near the water is better, more so will a sunked line.
lift rod to about shoulder height, the tip that is.
now without stopping, which will cause loose line and kill the loading.
Start to write a lower case letter e in the sky, starting at the inside of the e letter.
wind the rod tip around,
as the rod's path comes around to the bottom of the e, lift the rod back into the position to form a r/cast or single Spey, the Dloop behind the caster.
That easy !
And now the trick, if you could call it that, I think of it as the foundation step.
With a Double, left hand on the lower grip, hold this close to your body, as if to lock it there.
Once you master the cast, this locking of the lower hand doesn't matter too much.
"then cast it downstream, then up? "
?
cast across the stream, drift the line and fly down stream, snake roll and reposition the line and fly again across the stream.
'What are the anchor points they talk about.'
this is only the water's grip on the line, leader and or fly, which inturn helps load the rod.
this is why Spey casting on grass is near on impossible.
Another helping trick,
practice with just a bare rod, till you feel comfortable and can controll the size of the e that the rod tip is forming.
Kind regards,
UB
ps, another trick, don't try with a 15foot rod inside the house, more so with a ceiling fan :(
Thanks for the images, UB, so that is where the "roll" comes in, it gets more line into the action. The "e" - is it kind of horizontal in the air, like a belgian cast? This might be fun. I like the idea of getting the motion down before trying with a line.
Hi I have had 3 surgeries on my right shoulder all of which have been absolutely unsuccessful.
I was taught to use my arm by planting the upper arm on the side and using only the lower section of the arm and I cast out of a kayak. I can cast about 30 ft using that method, and I also use the right reel in method, so I not only reel in from the right I cast from the right. Use a longer rod as well it will help you and you should use a tip flexing rod that will allow for a shorter stroke movement.
I have been very sucseccfull in fly fishing this way and I dont tire that easily after about 4 hours or so then I start to use the other hand some which sucks at casting.
Good evening,
A couple of answers to try and help some people,
Here Fish.
"The "e" - is it kind of horizontal in the air, like a belgian cast?"
No, the e is in a vertical plane, unlike the Belgian/Welsh cast.
'This might be fun."
YES, ITS GREAT FUN, even if you don't catch a fish !
With a Double, to a lot of people casting over takes the catching of a fish in the pleasure department.
And a question from a couple of people, generally to cover all,
'I would love to get some info on light spey rods.'
Where would you like to start, as the subject is deeper than starting with those little single handed rods ?
'I have no big rivers to fish. Mostly lakes.'
This is the most common of all questions, why the image of big racing river has been portrayed as the only place for Doubles, I just don't understand !
Doubles are ideal, for ANYWHERE, where a spin fisher can fish and a fly fisher cannot because of the space behind the caster.
A Double will allow you to cast from and to places you never dreamed of before. AND these are the bigger fish live in always, places just out of reach because you cannot cast there.
Can be used in boats to prams.
From creeks to ocean beaches to ocean rocks.
Where ever you have a strong wind coming in behind the caster, that srong a backcast just doesn't go backwards, then a Spey cast released high will go at least 100feet with a 12fot 7/8w rod.
Cannot fish wee creeks..... this just breaks me up laughing, as the statement always comes from somone who hasn't used a Trout Spey rod, EVERYTIME !
If the caster has a health problem that effects his/her casting, then to share the cast load with two hands is easy and safer, to ones health.
Example, I have a friend who had a heart attack.
today his left hand takes about 1 to 2 seconds to do what his brain tells it, result his single hand casting is not all that nice and distance is lousy,
BUT now, he uses a Double, and can cast beautifully. (he now owns 3 Doubles )
'I am not sure it would help to use a spey rod over a single hand rod..."
The use of two hands to share the load, will change your life.... all positive !
'but I too have rotator cuff probs in boaf shoulders. I am ok now. But from everything I hear it is just a matter of time and I will get worse'
Of course it will IF you keep using the cause of the problem,
However, share the load with two hands, and KEEP YOUR ARMS down, then your problem has been rather reduced.
'But sure would like to learn how to cast a spey rod"
Its far easier than to learn to use a Single handed rod, no matter what the experts let me... but I teach casting Doubles, so wouldn't know too much...maybe.
If you can Roll Cast, then a Single Spey is just another form, thats all, BUT the fly will travel further and with greater casting ease.
The other Spey casts are basically forms of loading the Roll Cast.
'....and what kind of smaller spey rods there are out there. "
This is another PHD subject...
there is 4w's to 7/8w's with their length to match.
AND there are Switch rods also..now I bet that will confuse some ?
Trust I haven't confused too many casters,
as I have tried to keep my answers very, very brief.
Kind regards,
UB
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f2...nthreadbo3.jpg
"I have had 3 surgeries on my right shoulder all of which have been absolutely unsuccessful.
I was taught to use my arm by planting the upper arm on the side and using only the lower section of the arm and I cast out of a kayak. I can cast about 30 ft using that method, and "
A suggestion, use a Trout Spey or a Switch rod, then you will find its just as easy to cast with either hand or either shoulder and still cast over 60 feet with a little 5/6w 12footer.
Which will take the pressure of that problem shoulder.
Kind regards,
UB
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f2...eloopunwin.jpg
Chasing Bass on a local rain forest stream
Ronnie
I believe I had an injury similar to yours. Mine was severed tendon, torn bicep etc. My first surgery was two years ago, second a littler over a year ago and now they say the shoulder won't get any better. I learned to cast with my left hand but found it always felt awkward and as such casting wasn't as enjoyable. I also wasn't as good with the left as I was with the right. So I adjusted and found ways to cast with the right. Casting parralel with the water allows for pain free casting for longer periods and then when pain sets in cast with the left until pain lets off. You'll find ways to adjust. Just go by feel and it will work out. Won't be text book but will work. I also found (by accident or luck) that a vary light rod helps.
the easier it is to stop. A nine footer easier than a 10 - I've also been extra aware of how heavy the rod is (or seems to be). A rod which is actually heavier can seem lighter if it is balanced with the perfect reel. Experiment. Frankly I'm to the point where I don't care if the casting isn't so 'pretty' if I can get the fly where I want it. (Yes you really did read that from me, sad how we sink when things get tough.)
LF, Do you suppose that's the time we start fishing for our own pleasures and not for someone else's?