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...of seemingly transparent wraps on bamboo, and what effects it may have on building glass or graphite as well...
Thanks to Ron Kusse for the inspiration, hope I can perfect it as well as you have.
http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/...7091209007.jpg
Leo,
Can you expand on the technique if you have knowledge of it or tried it. I've tried but did not fair well. Some areas became clear and other's became opaque especially areas where the tag ends were under the wraps causing just a little air pocket.
R. Kusse is a master of this art is evidenced in your pic.
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God Blesses!
A wing & a Prayer! ----*<(((><~ ~ ~ ~
Quinn
Quinn,
I read a few threads on some other posts about this process and have used it in the past with success on darker colored threads but they were always colored to the tint of the thread. This wrap is using a very light yellow silk that when the varnish was applied became almost transparent. They say that white works best for this effect. Too, instead of lightly coating the wraps, they are saturated while on the drying motor, rotating, and that helps to keep the threads both moist and completely covered until it is very nearly dry. I love the effect it has, and what you cannot see in the photo is how the ferrules looked treated that same way, it is a very cool look.
http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/...7084209004.jpg
[This message has been edited by dleo6446 (edited 27 May 2006).]
I think sometimes the 'secrets' of the masters should stay just that. They are part of the make up of a master. That some secret or bit of wisdom may die with the master may be how things should remain. If the master shed all of his wisdom and methods he would no longer be unique. If through years of hard work and dedication he discovers materials or methods which set him apart, I see no obligation for him to 'share' anything with anyone. It is just as wrong to ask a chef for ingredients as to ask a rod maker for proprietary information. As it is rude and in appropriate to ask a person how much money they have in their bank account, how many sections a cattle rancher owns, what is in a veal dish, so too it is wrong to expect rod impregnation or wrap coating information.
However JC, a master usually had an apprentice to be able to pass along traditions to keep them from dying. This was done in most arts, however, limited to few individuals or apprentice's.
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Steve (Rookie)
Quinn - Chris Carlin, another great maker, put together a tutorial on transparent wraps for those interested in a step by step with pics - it's usable for both bamboo and graphite. It can be found here: [url=http://www.rodbuildingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=7286:44b99]http://www.rodbuildingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=7286[/url:44b99]
Kelvin
Kelvin
[This message has been edited by KRC (edited 27 May 2006).]
JC,
What value is there for tutoring, education, apprenticeship, written instructions, or even recipes (food or fly patterns) then I ask?
I'd hate to think what my Tae Kwon Do teacher (he was US Army stationed in Korea 70s) or his teacher (ROK Army) would have taken to their grave if they didn't impart their knowledge onto a few respecting students of the art: patience, honor, perseverence, character, commradery and even some defensive skills.
I recall being able to get in a good direct kick into the mid-section of my teacher one time; he immediately responded likewise which sent me back 8ft. I was not harmed with his technique but I knew what I could accomplish from what he had taught but also knew exactly who was the master.
In this case I know exactly who the master rod-builder is and fully acknowledge that in my inquiry.
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God Blesses!
A wing & a Prayer! ----*<(((><~ ~ ~ ~
Quinn
[This message has been edited by Wednesday Caster (edited 27 May 2006).]
Kelvin,
After 10 guides, 1 tip, 1butt section and 4 ferrule wraps (16 attempts), I was able to get 1 decent clear wrap= pretty darn poor result. Your reference link of Mr. Carlin's fine work and instructions gave great insight. Thank you.
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God Blesses!
A wing & a Prayer! ----*<(((><~ ~ ~ ~
Quinn
[This message has been edited by Wednesday Caster (edited 27 May 2006).]
I've done this on bamboo and graphite using a heated mixture of spar varnish and walnut alkyd for the first two saturating coats (on thin silk)--also makes colored silk and nylon thread translucent. To me, transparent varnishing is relatively easy. The hard part, beyond working with very fine silk, is getting the guide feet exactly the same length and shape, lined up perfectly, and making sure blackened guide feet stay black, since all the work that is ordinarilly obscured by colored thread is fully visible. Ferrule tabs are not exactly fun, either. You really have to do perfect work to pull this off--this is a master's technique primarily because it displays extreme attention to detail (or lack thereof).
-CC
Many things are not patented because they would reveal how something was actually done. I can't believe you guys think everyone should tell you exactly how to do things.
JC,
I can only ask. If an answer is given, then I am blessed.
Thank you for bringing such great resources of knowledge together via this site.
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God Blesses!
A wing & a Prayer! ----*<(((><~ ~ ~ ~
Quinn
By No means a master here...But I've been doing this with Tan nylon for a good while now...If you were to use preserver you would not get the effect....I think this one is relatively an easy one to stumble upon.
While using any really light color thread...
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"I've often wondered why it is that so many anglers spend so much money on,and pay so much attention to.the details on the wrong end of the fly line.If they took as much care in selecting or tying their flies as they did in the selection of the reel and rod,They might be able to gain the real extra edge that makes it possible to fool a fish that has,in fact,seen it all before" A.K.Best
Everyone wants to excel in this sport but at the same time we let traditionalists place restrictions on our tactics, methods, and ideas. I always assumed that fly fishing was a sport that allowed imagination, creation, adaptation, investigation, dedication, education, revelation? : Fox Statler, On Spinners (Not the dainty Dry Fly kind) "Spinner'd Minner Fly"
"Wish ya great fishing"
Bill
Not giving away any big secrets, here. There are various ways to do clear wraps and most of them are pretty widely known among builders, especially in the bamboo world. The point of my post was that knowledge doesn't equal ability. The perfection of guide preparation and alignment that show through clear wraps, along with perfect threadwork, including hidden thread tags, require skill and patience, as well as extreme attention to the smallest detail. Telling the basic process doesn't provide the critical little skills in thread handling and varnishing that are only gained through long experience (screwing up and working through it or doing over).
This is way cool. Wow. Thanks for sharing. JW
Certainly no master here either ...for sure! What I have learned about this process is that the real secrets are in the varnish's used and the thread type more than anything else to achieve tranlucent wraps. Guide foot preparation is important, Ferrule transitions are important, tags, or their handeling is important as well. You can do all of the detail work and use the wrong type of varnish and they will come out streaked or even worse. With darker threads, you will still get tranlucense, but it will be shaded darker than the thread or even completely change the color of it. A good example of that is Pearsall's Salmonberry (nearly a pink color on the spool, but when the varnish is applied, it turns into a beautiful tranlucent red.
The other thing about rod building in general is that if it were not for some of the masters sharing their secrets, most of us would not have the knowledge that we have acquired. Just talking to, or reading the works from rod makers like Kusse, Thramer, Carpenter, Mike Brooks, and many many more is an education in itself. by the way, if you can latch on to a rod that was made by Kusse, Thramer or any of these great rod makers of today, it will surely be the Payne, Leonard, Garrison, etc of tomorrow. Look at Bill Oysters work as well. An outstanding rodmaker that gives classes and is eager to help any young (or old) rod maker wannabe improve their skills. That is what makes this great thing "rodbuilding" so great. Everyone is eager to help and is more than willing to share their knowledge and experiences to help others.