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Robert,
They were fishing using "mulberry" patterns...Flip wasn't doing too well until the guide showed him to make a more "noisy" cast..like they were falling from trees. I am pretty sure they were fishing here in Ohio during the same time (but in different water) they fished "The Wilds", which is reclaimed strip pits...fishing there is exclusive to guides & clients through Mad Rivr outfitters in Columbus, Ohio...pretty pricey, too.
Mike
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A couple of other things I might add:
1. Don't leave home without your polarized sunglasses when sight fishing for carp. Next to my rod and my flies, my sunglasses are the most important equipment I own.
2. Don't be afraid to dap for a carp deep in the cattails or reeds. When you have a take, lift gently. It's easy to bury the barb in one because their mouths are rubbery. Then give them all the slack they want and don't excite them. They'll ease out of the cattails to deep water because they know something is wrong. Keep giving them slack then when they get out to the deep water, untangle your line, reel it up, apply the pressure to them and the fight's on. Same goes when you cast to one and stick him near the reeds. If you apply a bunch of pressure to him, he may run into the reeds (they'll usually run the opposite direction of the pressure). Just give him all the slack he wants and when he gets to deep water, apply the pressure to him. Because I give them a bunch of slack to get clear of the cattails or reeds, I don't bend down the barbs. They stay hooked better.
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Robert,
I mash down my barbs religiously and haven't lost a fish yet (aside from the rare breakoff or bent hook). Different strokes for different folks, I guess.
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I have to say that I find this thread VERY interesting, but I have to play devil's advocate as I disagree with many of the statements here.
1) Feeding 24/7: During the hot parts of summer, at least here in north Texas, the carp feed pretty much solid ALL day long. Their metabolism is very high, and since the food they eat is very small in proportion to their body weight, they must almost constantly eat to maintain physical health.
2) Flies. I caught around 100 carp last year, and for 98% of that, I used only one fly pattern in one color and one size, a #8 curved nymph hook. I'm clearly in the presentationist camp when it comes to carp, it's all about the presentation.
3) Spooked fish. While it is true that you may spook a whole shoal of carp when you spook one, I have often spooked a lone carp and watched others feed within 15 feet or more of the spooked fish. Also, if you will let things "settle down" after spooking a fish, they will almost always resume feeding within a short number of seconds or minutes. I do not mean 10 or 15, I mean 30 seconds or two minutes. Fish are used to hearing things splash around in their environment.
4) Rod size. I like fishing carp on all size rods, had an especially fun New Year's day with my 6'6" 2 weight. However it is a LOT easier to dap to a carp 8-12 feet away from you with a 9 foot rod than a 6 footer.
BTW I fish barbless too for carp, actually I fish barbless for everything from trout, bass, bonefish, redfish, and have no complaints.
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--playin' with my piscatorial pals--
[url=http://www.trashonthefly.com:114d0]http://www.trashonthefly.com[/url:114d0]
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Dave, I was hoping you would reply to this topic at some point since I know carp is one of your passions and you have a great deal of knowledge about them. I certainly agree on the feeding piece. I just began fly rod carping last year and it seems like some of my best fishing was done mid-day, mid-summer. And in most of my dapping situations, I prefer using a 9 ft. rod because I can be positioned further from the fish with less risk of spooking him. I just seem to make better, softer presentations when dapping with a longer rod. That's really interesting about the #8 curved nymph hook. I'm going to start trying that pattern. On the one fish that took me 50-75 casts to catch, it may be that he finally got the right presentation rather than the right fly! This series of posts just keeps getting better and better. I'm making a hard copy and adding it to my fishing library.
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Dave,
In regard to #2:
I probably catch 95% of my carp on one pattern, one size, two colors (black or olive). But there are times when you have to get outside that little box. And it takes a lot of experimenting 'til you find the right combination of fly and presentation that works for you. If it wasn't hard to figure out, this thread wouldn't be called "Carp Frustrations"! http://www.flyanglersonline.com/bb/wink.gif
In regard to #4:
I'll grant it that it's a lot easier to dap at fish that are 8-12 feet away with a long rod, but it's a LOT harder to dap at fish that are less than 8-12 feet away, which is the range that I hook a slight majority of my carp in when I'm able to wade fish for them. With a short rod I can cast 8-12 feet no problems, but with a long rod I can't dap any closer than that; so short is my choice most of the time.
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Dave,
You make some good points but to expand on some things you said, I would like to point out that in my opinion:
1.Although "some" fish may indeed feed all day in the Summer, the best action is early and if you want to up your chances, be there early. I notice a marked decline in the number of feeding fish I see in the shallows around 1 or 2 pm. normally.
2.As far as fishing with a size 8 fly, that may be local to your lakes. I can't get the ones around here to take a fly that big as readily as I can a smaller fly. It probably depends on what they're feeding on.
3. As far as spooking one fish may not spook the whole pod, well that depends. If you fish to the outside fish (the one closest to deep water) first and he spooks to deep water then your OK but if you cast to the interior fish and he spooks and blows by the others leaving a trail of mud, then you can basically kiss the rest of the fish good by and waiting awhile for them to settle down won't matter at that point.
4. In my opinion it is a LOT easier to dap with a short rod than a long rod as more often than not when I'm dapping, I'm dapping up close and personal as they say, otherwise I'm casting. With a 9 foot rod if the carp are really close, you have to "choke up" on the rod to dap to them which causes you to lose control of the line and it also causes the rod to be out of balance with the weight of the reel hanging behind your hand. And, the longer the rod, the harder it is to control. When dapping, you're trying to hold the fly right in front of the carps nose and the longer the rod, the more it moves around with any movement of your hand or wrist. Also, try dapping deep inside the cattails with a 9 foot rod. It's very difficult to control whereas it's not so difficult with a short rod. Having said all that though, I can see an advantage of the longer rod when the fish are in open water and a bit further away but for most of the dapping situations I've encountered, I'll choose the short rod.
Robert
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All good points.
BTW, if you find that you are "too close" to a carp for dapping, as I sometimes do as well, rather than choking up on the rod, put the tip up in the air.
I was carp fishing with a guy that I really like, this isn't a slam on him, just an observation. I was standing off to his side about 3-4 feet, very close and wanted to see his fly or clear some salad from it or something. I said "hand me your fly" and his response was that he couldn't, I was too close. If he would have pointed his rod at the sky and leaned it toward me about 3 inches I could have grabbed any part of his line or leader wherever I chose. It's funny, but sometimes we miss the obvious! (Not saying anyone is missing anything here, just cracked me up at the time)
BTW one thing I thought would help with my 6'6" rod was more line out the top, therefore slightly better control on short casts. I don't know about the rest of you guys but it didn't help me a bit!!! I thought it would but maybe I just got used to slinging leader only.
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Dave,
Try picking up the rod tip to get closer with a 9' rod in the Oklahoma wind and your fly will be in the next county http://www.flyanglersonline.com/bb/wink.gif
I have done lots of trial and error, short rods are best for me.
And lastly, some tips for very close casting-
Furled leaders make casting nothing but leader a little easier.
If you know you're only casting at short range, overline your rod by two or even three weights. My 2 weight loads and feels great with a small distance of 5 weight line out the tip.
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I've gotta agree with Okie on raising the rod on windy days. You'll never be able to put the fly where you want it. I always take a long rod and a short rod already rigged for carp and then select the rod on-sight that best matches the fishing conditions of the day. If there is a strong wind and/or the carp or close in, I use my 6 1/2 foot rod. If there is no wind and the fish are spooking easier than normal, then I use my 9 foot rod. Many times I've experimented with using both rods on the same day as conditions changed. I just don't think there is one best carp rig for all conditions just like I don't think there is one best rig for bass or trout for all conditions. I find that I'm in a much better position to catch fish if I match my rig to the current fishing conditions. Also I hate getting out on clowdy days for carp. Even with a good set of polaroids and a big brimed cap, I have a lot of difficulty seeing the fish without direct sunlight unless the water is crystal clear and there's not a breath of wind. I just as soon go to other parts of the lake and fish for bass on clowdy days. Great posts guys, I'm learning a lot!